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Thursday update

The jury continues to deliberate today, while attorneys for the Chicago Tribune have asked for the judge to disclose their names after the trial.

Tribune attorneys appeared before U.S. District Judge James Zagel on Wednesday on an emergency motion to ask him to reveal the anonymous jurors' names after their render their verdict.

But the Tribune is going to have to answer several tough questions from Zagel first.

Zagel asked the Tribune if there was any significant 1st Amendment issue if the jurors' names were released immediately after they handed down their verdict - or if the judge waited 48 hours before releasing the names.

He asked them to address the fact that the jury has been promised anonymity - with no mention of ever revoking that anonymity.

He questioned whether the jury should be appointed counsel to address this issue.

Zagel also noted that jurors will be given the opportunity to speak to the media after the verdict in a conference room near the courtroom.

Zagel questioned if there was any significant difference between a juror being given the opportunity to speak to a reporter and a reporter being given the opportunity to ask a juror to talk.

And he asked the Tribune attorneys to address how the news media has covered jurors in high profile trials much more aggressively in recent years.

Lots of tough questions, and the smart money says the judge likely won't be granting the Tribune's request.

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Comments

It just proves to me that their all innocent

Richie the RAT has been in every outfit trial as a witness. Because he neede protection he would do anything the FBI wanted him to do. He hsa not been around the neighborhood for years, and had nothing to do with any of what he is saying. That is why they call him the (RAT). He was never in the car when LaMAntia got reprimanded. R.J was there but sat on his hands. There was one man in the back seat who hit Shorty one time in the side of his head.And that was it. Two days lateer one man was sent shortys home and was told that old man wanted him with them,when he moved back to the neighborhood. Frank C is the man who came to shorty's home to pass that message. LaMantia was well like by the boss,but things are done a little different with that society .

Anything on police corruption and towns mentioned?


WARMBIR RESPONDS: We got a mention of Chicago police corruption in testimony Tuesday. Nick Calabrese said during one bookmaking season, there was a phone number they could call to find out who the Chicago cops were going to bust that week.

The man who set it up, allegedly, was the late Chicago cop Michael Ricci.

Sorry to comment so frequently but I can't find hte answers to my questions in any news articles.
I see there was testimony today about the murders of Tony and Michael, they don't list everyone who was there. I find it hard to believe the prosecution is leaving this question out so I can only surmise the media isn't covering it.

I'm curious who the original hit team was in Vegas on the botched attemtp, as well as who the final hit team included. I know some of the key guys have been mentioned but has list of all participants been stated for the record ? Were there any changes what so ever from the time they left Vegas on the botched attempt to when they committed the murder of Vaci?


WARMBIR RESPONDS:

You asked for it, you got it.

Or at least the questions to which I know the answers.

The men allegedly involved in killing the Spilotros in the Bensenville area basement, as identified by Nick Calabrese in testimony Wednesday:

1. Nicholas Calabrese
2. His capo, James LaPietra
3. John Fecarotta
4. John DiFronzo
5. Sam Carlisi
6. Joseph Ferriola
7. Louie "The Mooch" Eboil
8. Louis Marino
9. James Marcello
10. Ernest "Rocky" Infelise
Another man or two who were in the basement Nick Calabrese didn't know.

The men directly involved in the murder of Emil Vaci:

1. Joseph Hansen
2. Nick Calabrese
3. Jimmy DiForti
4. Paul Schiro

Other men involved in the planning or in the earlier stages of the murder:
1. Frank Schweihs
2. James LaPietra

The hit team that was sent out of Vegas to kill Tony Spilotro:

This varied as people came and went but it included Nick Calabrese, John Fecarotta, Frank Schweihs and Jimmy DiForti.

We may have a better idea of that team as the trial progresses.

Involved in the actual burial of the Spilotro brothers is allegedly to be as follows:

- Giovanni "Big John" Fecarotta: he was killed for setting up the botched burial, of course.
- Albert "Caesar" Tocco: boss of the Chicago Heights crew at that time.
- Albert "Chicky" Roviero: Tocco's man in Northwestern Indiana.
- Dominic "Toots" Palermo
- Nicholas "Nicky" Guzzino

With all the people involved, somewhere around 10 or so in the Bensenville basement at the time of the murders and four or five others involved in the actual burial, that's at least 15 men involved. It's a wonder nobody talked before Nick Calabrese. That's a lot of people to worry about opening up their mouths!

Also, this is the first I've read where Lou Marino was in the basement as well, which does make sense since he was one of Rocky Infelise's top men and Infelise was allegedly there.

Thank you very much...its so nice to have our questions answered. Are you in the courtroom? I've been trying to get a read on the prosecution's approach and I can't wrap my brain around it. It seems it isnt "fluid",but i'm not there so maybe i'm just missing too much..

WARMBIR RESPONDS: I've been in the courtroom covering the trial every day.

The prosecution's approach has been straightforward, and so far, the defense, while scoring some points, really hasn't taken out one of their witnesses yet.

What you're not getting in the newspaper every day (either ours or the Tribune) is a recap of the testimony of every single witness at trial.

First, we don't have the space to do it. Second, sometimes these witnesses are relatively minor ones who simply confirm a few points another witness made.

Now that's important for the prosecution - having one witness independently confirm another witnesses statement - but it may not make the story.

WHAT DETAILS WHERE PROVIDED OF THE SPILOTRO SLAYINGS, CALABRESE MENTIONS STRANGULATION, WHAT ABOUT THE SEVERE BEATING THEY TOOK? WAS IT POST STRANULATION. DID THE FORCE TONY TO WATCH MICHAEL BEING BEAT? WHAT WAS ROCCO INFELICE'S ROLE?

WARMBIR RESPONDS: There have been a lot of questions from readers wanting more information on the murders.

So in the coming days, I'll be posting more information with the detailed testimony of Nicholas Calabrese, which should answer some of the questions you mention above.

Who has been at the trial, any celebrity faces associated with the mob? Has there been some laughter throughout the trial?

WARMBIR RESPONDS: No celebrity sightings as of yet, but you'll hear it here first, if and when one happens.

Despite the grim topic matter, there has been some laughter during the trial.

One time, when the defendants were going out for bathroom breaks while the trial was in session, the judge made it clear he wasn't going to stop the trial for them and that they were waiving their appearance.

Defendant Joseph Lombardo noted that he has to go a lot, which generated some laughter.

Rick Halprin, Lombardo's attorney, is known to shoot off a quick witticism.

And the judge, James Zagel, gets some chuckles for his dry wit.

I would try to recreate one of moments for you, but it's the kind of humor you have to be there for.

'No Nose' DiFronzo and 'Pizza' Al Tornabene are bulletproof, everyone in the city has known this for decades. They need to be mentioned in the same breath as Jordan, Oprah, Capone, mayor daley Sr., ...whoever else you wanna throw in. Tornabene and DiFronzo, the real chicago

Does anyone know of the exact location in Bensenville the murders of the Spilotro Brothers happen? Who was the owner of the house?

Steve-I was wondering if Frank Caruso,Sr. would be brought up in this trial any more in your opinion.It seems he kind of has skated away from any wrong-doing in these indictments and testimony.


WARMBIR RESPONDS: Are you talking about the father or the son? The father is dead. The son is still with us and the one who has been mentioned most at trial.

The son, Frank "Tootsie Babe" Caruso has been mentioned at trial several times, but you're right to note he hasn't been charged with anything.

Since there's certainly going to be more discussion involving the 26th Street/Chinatown crew - the crew of Frank Calabrese Sr. and Nicholas Calabrese - it's always possible Caruso's name will come up again.

Steve, i read that Michael Talerico was "cooperating" with the FEDS in this trial, will he be testifying or is there any truth to him flippin. Also, is there a known reason that "shorty" La Mantia wasnt a "made" guy.Im pretty sure he was 100% of italian decent.

WARMBIR RESPONDS: Michael Talarico testified on July 16 with immunity.

Talarico admitted to being a bookmaker and testified that he paid Nicholas Calabrse $650 a week in street tax in the 1980s.

Talarico testified that before Nicholas Calabrese went to prison in the mid 1990s, Calabrese told him that he no longer had to pay the tax.

Calabrese's friend, Ronnie Jarrett, allegedly had other ideas.

Talarico said Jarrett insisted he keep paying, and when Talarico balked, he got jumped.

As for Shorty LaMantia, I don't know why he wasn't made, and nothing has come up about that at trial.

By turning against his family and brother, does Nick Calabrese still face the death penlty or not?


WARMBIR RESPONDS: As a result of his plea agreement, Nick Calabrese does not face the death penalty, although he still could get life in prison.

By cooperating, Nick Calabrese is hoping he's going to get something less than life in prison, but the final decision is up to the judge.

STEVE- BY THE WAY THANKS FOR THE RESPONSES.VERY INTERESTING STUFF. WHEN YOU SAY TALARICO WAS JUMPED YOU MEANT HE WAS "SLAPPED AROUND", CORRECT. ALSO, IN YOUR OPINION DO YOU KNOW IF fRANK "TOOTSIE BABE" CARUSO WILL BE TESTIFYING OR ACCUSED OF ANYTHING. IT'S BIT WEIRD TO ME HOW,WITH ALL THIS 26TH ST.CREW TALK VERY LITTLE IS MENTIONED OF HIM.


WARMBIR RESPONDS: When I say bookmaker Mike Talarico testified he was jumped, he said he was walking along with Ronald Jarrett one day and was attacked from behind by someone he said he didn't see.

I don't know if Frank "Tootsie Babe" Caruso is testifying, although if he were, I imagine it would have become known by now.

Caruso's name comes up occasionally at trial, and I suspect it may be coming up more.

Can you give background on why Tony Zizzo's photo was included as an exhibit on July 9? Any word during the trial where he is?


WARMBIR RESPONDS: No word on where he is, but I don't think we're going to be seeing Zizzo take the witness stand.

I don't recall the first time the photo was introduced, but Zizzo's name has come up a few times at trial.

He was, for instance, one of the mobsters allegedly made with Frank Calabrese Sr. and Nick Calabrese in 1983.


i am glad these loser thugs are going to rot in jail + die. the mob is for morons who are too stupid to make good money by competing fairly + it costs us all a lot of money in the long run.

RE: "'No Nose' DiFronzo and 'Pizza' Al Tornabene are bulletproof, everyone in the city has known this for decades."

1) This is an interesting comment and is apparently true. If DiFronzo has been implicated in the murder of the Spilotros (or at least identified as being there), why hasn't he been indicted, as well?

2) Why is Tornabene's name suddenly coming up, and how do people even know his name? I saw everything on ABC about the "making" ceremony, his bookmaking past, and how he had one of his lieutenants (probably) killed. But, I've also heard that he has no criminal record whatsoever. Warmbir, do you know any other details about Al Tornabene? If he was making mafiosi in the 80's, then that presupposes that he is a made man, which means--at least in Chicago--that he's murdered for the Outfit. Any speculation? How has he maintained such a low profile?

3) Who comprises the hierarchy of the Outfit? Calabrese Sr. has made it sound like Lombardo and Andriacci are nobodies. Can we assume it's DiFronzo that's boss with Tornabene as consigliere?

And who is waiting in the wings?


Here's a copy of a story I did for the Sun-Times on June 10 that answers many of your questions.


Who will be the new Tony Soprano of the Chicago mob?

With so many mob leaders on trial or dead, the Chicago Outfit is in disarray, law enforcement sources say.

It could be the "Pizza Man" acting as caretaker.

Or "No Nose" could still be pulling the strings, some Outfit watchers believe.

The "Pizza Man" is Al Tornabene, the 84-year-old former owner of a suburban pizza parlor. He has kept an extremely low profile for a reputed mob leader and has never been arrested by the FBI. Recently, his name has come up in conversations the FBI secretly recorded in prison between reputed top Chicago mob boss James "Little Jimmy" Marcello and his younger brother, Michael Marcello.

Tornabene has been seen eating in Rush Street restaurants with another top reputed mobster, Anthony "Little Tony" Zizzo, who was last seen leaving his Westmont home in August last year and hasn't been heard from since. Zizzo was responsible for overseeing one of the Outfit's most lucrative enterprises, the illegal video poker machines in bars throughout Chicago.

Tornabene has long been a mob leader, authorities say. In 1983, for instance, he presided over a ceremony at which several mobsters were inducted into full membership rights of the Outfit, court records show. Among the men who were made were Zizzo, reputed mob hit man Frank Calabrese Sr. and his brother, Nick Calabrese, who has admitted in a plea agreement with the feds that he killed at least 14 people for the Chicago Outfit. He is cooperating with the FBI.

"No Nose" is the much better known John DiFronzo, who is in his late 70s and has long been reputed to be a respected elder of the Chicago Outfit. DiFronzo is known for his business acumen and wide range of investments, including car dealerships. Some mob watchers think DiFronzo has long been rivals with James Marcello and is not overly upset over his arrest.

Tornabene hung up during a phone call Friday when asked if he was running the Outfit.

DiFronzo could not be reached for comment.

RE: "'No Nose' DiFronzo and 'Pizza' Al Tornabene are bulletproof, everyone in the city has known this for decades."

1) This is an interesting comment and is apparently true. If DiFronzo has been implicated in the murder of the Spilotros (or at least identified as being there), why hasn't he been indicted, as well?

2) Why is Tornabene's name suddenly coming up, and how do people even know his name? I saw everything on ABC about the "making" ceremony, his bookmaking past, and how he had one of his lieutenants (probably) killed. But, I've also heard that he has no criminal record whatsoever. Warmbir, do you know any other details about Al Tornabene? If he was making mafiosi in the 80's, then that presupposes that he is a made man, which means--at least in Chicago--that he's murdered for the Outfit. Any speculation? How has he maintained such a low profile?

3) Who comprises the hierarchy of the Outfit? Calabrese Sr. has made it sound like Lombardo and Andriacci are nobodies. Can we assume it's DiFronzo that's boss with Tornabene as consigliere?

And who is waiting in the wings?


WARMBIR RESPONDS: Here's the text of a story I wrote
for the June 10 edition of the Sun-Times that ABC 7 followed up on. I think it answer some of your questions.

Who will be the new Tony Soprano of the Chicago mob?

With so many mob leaders on trial or dead, the Chicago Outfit is in disarray, law enforcement sources say.

It could be the "Pizza Man" acting as caretaker.

Or "No Nose" could still be pulling the strings, some Outfit watchers believe.

The "Pizza Man" is Al Tornabene, the 84-year-old former owner of a suburban pizza parlor. He has kept an extremely low profile for a reputed mob leader and has never been arrested by the FBI. Recently, his name has come up in conversations the FBI secretly recorded in prison between reputed top Chicago mob boss James "Little Jimmy" Marcello and his younger brother, Michael Marcello.

Tornabene has been seen eating in Rush Street restaurants with another top reputed mobster, Anthony "Little Tony" Zizzo, who was last seen leaving his Westmont home in August last year and hasn't been heard from since. Zizzo was responsible for overseeing one of the Outfit's most lucrative enterprises, the illegal video poker machines in bars throughout Chicago.

Tornabene has long been a mob leader, authorities say. In 1983, for instance, he presided over a ceremony at which several mobsters were inducted into full membership rights of the Outfit, court records show. Among the men who were made were Zizzo, reputed mob hit man Frank Calabrese Sr. and his brother, Nick Calabrese, who has admitted in a plea agreement with the feds that he killed at least 14 people for the Chicago Outfit. He is cooperating with the FBI.

"No Nose" is the much better known John DiFronzo, who is in his late 70s and has long been reputed to be a respected elder of the Chicago Outfit. DiFronzo is known for his business acumen and wide range of investments, including car dealerships. Some mob watchers think DiFronzo has long been rivals with James Marcello and is not overly upset over his arrest.

Tornabene hung up during a phone call Friday when asked if he was running the Outfit.

DiFronzo could not be reached for comment.

Nicholas Calabrese gave a detailed account of how he, Marcello and Calabrese's brother, Frank Calabrese Sr., were made with several other men in a ceremony in a closed Chicago area restaurant in 1983.

Anyone know which restaurant?

WARMBIR RESPONDS: Nick Calabrese said he forgot the name of the restaurant but said it was on Roosevelt near Mannheim.

Thnx for the reply. Have not lived in the area for a long while, but grew up near the corners of Wolf and Roosevelt. Biggest outfit joint in the area was at Wolf and 22nd st, the Lilac Lodge, although there was another place at Wolf and Roosevelt named Orgos, which seemed to burn down every year or two. Corner of Roosevelt and Mannheim was the Swedish Manor but that could not have been the place. Just west of Swedish Manor were a half dozen or so small bars and such, including the oldest and my favorite, the Roundup, frequented by C. Lindbergh many years ago. There was one place just east of there that seemed more like a social club, dont even remember it having a name, just a Blatz beer sign in the window...
Anyhow, if anyone has been in the area recently, like to get an update - going on 20 years that I have not been around there...

Is it true that at the trial that it was stated that Rocky Infelise was under FBI surveillance at the time of the murder of the Spilotro brothers and therefore couldn't have been present in that Bensenville basement at the time of the murders, as stated by Nick Calabrese?

WARMBIR RESPONDS: That's the contention by Thomas Breen, the attorney for reputed top Chicago mob boss James Marcello.

Calabrese responded that he told the feds that he believed he saw Rocky Infelise at the Bensenville area home out of the corner of his eye but wasn't sure he was there.

Score one for the defense.

Tornabene a boss? Where does this information come from? I read trial transcripts from the Laborers Union trials several years ago
and the FBI was surveilling John Mattassa and Mickey Marcello at a meeting in a restaurant with Tornabene. According to the Feds, it was a very heated argument with Mattassa raising his voice and pointing his finger in Tornabene's face, indicating to the FBI that Mattassa was of a higher rank than Tornabene. If he is making people how could a guy get away with pointing a finger in his face and raising his voice to a boss without getting clipped?

WARMBIR RESPONDS: The information comes from a variety of sources, including the transcripts of secretly recorded conversations between James Marcello and his half brother, Michael, when Michael is visiting him in prison at Milan, Mich.

As for the Laborers transcripts, I recall the episode you're talking about.

Doesn't Tornabene quickly and curtly respond and immediately shut Matassa up? I believe that's how the episode ended, with Tornabene clearly in the superior role.

Thanks. I didn't know that. I don't recall if Tornabene smacked him back down or not. I'll go back and reread. Thanks for all the great coverage of the trial. Keep it up. By far the best of any news media.

You know whats funny... Gerry Scarpelli admitted to killing the Daubers with Butch Petrocelli. So how are they saying Frank C and Ronnie J did it? Somone is lying obviously.

After a brief period of coffee and conversation, the lawyer drove off. Charlotte and Billy steered the Lincoln out of the parking lot to meet their fate. When the road seemed clear Frank Calabrese allegedly swung the "work car" directly in front of the path of the Dauber vehicle, at which point the van driven by Scalise pulled up along side the Lincoln. Butch Petrocelli aimed a .30-caliber semi-automatic carbine out the window of the van and fired a volley directly at Dauber. Just in case Butch missed the mark, Gerry Scarpelli took aim with a 12-gauge shotgun.

Dauber, who was a cooperating witness for the government since his arrest on cocaine and gun charges the previous year, lost control of his car and crashed into a tree off the main highway. Petrocelli immediately ordered the van stopped in order for Scarpelli to inspect the wrecked car and apply the final touches of death if need be. "Go make sure it's done - finish it!" came the brutal directive.

Gerry Scarpelli, whose rap sheet Included 18 arrests since he came to the attention of the police in 1960, covered his face with a ski mask and walked slowly toward the bullet-pierced wreck. The Daubers were lying motionless in the car?their bodies riddled with gunshot. Scarpelli pumped two shots into Billy Dauber's head, but did not bother with Charlotte. She was already dead and beyond caring.

The van was driven into a clump of bushes down the road. Petrocelli hastily doused the vehicle with lighter fluid and set it on fire to destroy the physical evidence and any traces of fingerprints. The murder weapons were completely dismantled, chopped into small pieces and disposed of in the Cal Sag Canal from the Route 83 bridge. Nothing more was said of the grisly crime that had just been committed except for the usual massive media coverage. Neither Scarpelli nor his associates received any monies from the Outfit for their work. No payment. No vacation funds coming their way for a Las Vegas junket. .

"It was just business," a weary and slightly apoplectic Scarpelli later explained to the government.


STEVE WARMBIR RESPONDS: I don't believe anyone has to necessarily be lying.

Frank Calabrese allegedly drove the car in front of the Daubers' vehicle, to ensure they slowed down enough so they could be shot from the passing vehicle.

Ronald Jarrett allegedly was driving the car with the shooters.

So I don't think the Scarpelli version you present and the one from Nick Calabrese necessarily conflict.

Referring to few posts above this one.
Anthony "LT" Zizzo. I am just wondering who on trial would benefit the most out of him disappearing?
Anyone have any ideas?

Who was Ralph Peluso and what was is role. Also is Michael Talarico the one who owns the bar at 31st and Wells.

Ralph Peluso has been identified in court as a one-time bookmaker who paid street tax to the Calabrese street crew.

Talarico, another bookmaker, was the former owner of Punchinello's on 31st.

I think they are all dirtbags and pray they rot in hell. Good riddens. They give hard-working Italian Americans and all of Chicago a bad name.

Did the younger Jarrett testify today and if so what information did he prvovide for the prosecution if any?

What other major whitnesses does the prosecution have yet to call?

Keep up the good work your coverage is best.


STEVE WARMBIR RESPONDS: The younger Jarrett did testify today.

Instead of repeating myself, you can check out the story online in the Sun-Times to see what Jarrett said. There will be a blog entry or two coming up related to his testimony.

As for major witnesses, there's an interesting one up on Wednesday, Bobby "The Beak" Siegel, a
master thief and alleged killer for the mob.

Warmbir, any ideas on why DiFronzo is not on trial here? He has been fingered as being in attendance at the Bensenville murders. There's no physical evidence against Marcello, yet he was indicted. Could the Feds be building a separate case against DiFronzo & Tornabene?


STEVE WARMBIR RESPONDS: I'm speculating, but prosecutors appear to have more on Marcello than just the testimony of Nicholas Calabrese.

Prosecutors are expected to play secretly recorded conversations between James Marcello and his half-brother, Michael, where they speak in code but appear to be terribly concerned about the Spilotro murders and what Nicholas Calabrese can tell the feds about the slayings.


dam you people are obsessed like 12 year old girls over some boy. take it easy nerds.

Wambir, any insight on the implication that Lombardo isn't a "made" man? I've heard that the "making ceremony" never was a big thing in Chicago. I find it hard to believe that Lombardo is just a figurehead thrown in to fool the Feds. He at least was a boss at one time, judging by the company he kept (the "Last Supper" picture).


STEVE WARMBIR RESPONDS: I think you're confusing Joey Lombardo and James Marcello.

There hasn't been any testimony about Lombardo being made.

There's been some about Marcello getting made, mainly from Nick Calabrese who said they were inducted into full mob membership together in 1983.

Marcello's attorney, Thomas Breen, pointed out that Marcello is half Irish and couldn't be made under the criteria Nick Calabrese listed, including that the inductee be fully Italian.

That said, there has been testimony that one of the other men who was made was only half Italian.

Frank Calabrese Sr. complained about this because he felt his friend and alleged fellow killer Ronald Jarrett should have been made too, except he's half Italian as well.

Steve, it appears the prosecution is trying to discredit the witnesses. But calling them a rat hardly seems like a discredit to their testimony.

What did the lawyer Lopez have to gain by calling Nick Calabrese a serial killer?

How come we haven't heard anything about The "Indian" Shiro at this point?

STEVE WARMBIR RESPONDS: I don't think the prosecution is trying to discredit its own witnesses.

When the prosecution brings out something negative about a witness, say an unflattering nickname or a person's criminal record, they do it because they know the defense is aware of it and will bring it out if they don't.

By bringing the negative up first, which is called fronting it, the prosecution won't appear to the jury as if it's hiding anything from it - as the prosecution would if it didn't mention the problem.

Joe "The Shark" Lopez did throw out the serial killer question, and we can debate whether it was effective.

I think it was quite obvious to the jury that Nick Calabrese has killed a lot of people.

Lopez may have wanted to unsettle Nick Calabrese with the question and throw him off guard.

We have heard about Paul "The Indian" Schiro in testimony from Nick Calabrese. He testified about Schiro's alleged participation in the hit of Emil Vaci.

Firstly, allow me to say, I agree w/the poster above who stated about these ppl continuing to give all the honest and hardworking Americans of Italian descent (really all honest ppl of Italian descent around the world, including in Italy) an even worse name than we've already had. We've almost become comical, in some ways, but then of course there's also the sheer ferocity of these ppl and their associates, which makes it far less of a laughing matter of course in real life.

This trial is terrible for us. And I'm not just trying to be 'melodramatic' or anything about this either. This sucks, I'm serious. This is about as much fun for ppl like me, with strong and very obvious 'ethnic' Italian name who is the child of an Italian immigrant, as terrorism-related news must be for the American-born children of , say, Pakistani immigrants. We are and have been (largely at our own fault I realize) permanently tarred by the 'Mob' brush, and the notion that criminality and violence is somehow inherent to us, the same way that (some) feel today that blowing things up and sending body parts flying is inherent to Islam (to again stay w/that comparison).

All of that having been said, what of the Stone Park area?? Any mention made of that?? I have been following , online, a recent thread that has been running in a local news / msg forum, about the Galaxy Adul