Bye bye Ben

Ben starts making free throws, Joe Smith starts making shots; then they get traded.

I hate Ben Wallace let LeBron be frustrated with his lack of passion of heart.

THIS DEAL HAS TO HAPPEN!!!!

Drew gooden is young and can be held onto and would make an excellent addition to the front court. He can score and rebound, and would work perfectly with the screen and rolls.
Plus, dumping Ben Wallace's salary is crucial so that we can resign AT LEAST Luol, if not both lu and ben gordon.

if paxon can make this happen, he has rescued his reputation in my view...

Yes!!! Great trade, Pax. Too bad we had to give up Joe Smith, too, but that was a minor cost to pay to unload Big Ben's contract. Drew Gooden gives us a valuable piece, a 4 who plays in the post, scores, rebounds, and could play well along side a Noah or a Thomas. Plus him and Kirk have to love being teamed back up again. Larry Hughes, even though he has a bloated contract, too, gives us a better piece that what Wallace had left. A tall 2 who is an excellent defender, and, even though he hasn't been doing it lately, has shown he can score in this league. This is a coup: give Paxson the credit he deserves.

we are not saving any salary cap... in fact we are at best a wash, hughes is making 12.5 mil for the next 3 years, and gooden is making 6.5 for 2 years... this is in relation to smiths 5.5 for 2 yeras, and wallaces 14.5 the next 3 (ben wallace has a contract where he makes less as he gets further into the contract. also, we have no need for hughes! what happens to thabo?!?!? we now have 8 players 6'7 or shorter, du,hinrich, gordon, thabo, hughes, noce, deng.

This is a good trade. While I worry about Larry Hughes creaky body, we do get a decent gaurd with some size and an average 4 to pair with Joakim Noah. The team got ALOT younger all of a sudden and Shannon Brown should realize some playing time here. The only guy I am going to miss is J-Smith but Gooden's production apparently equals Smith's numbers-wise.

What a RELIEF! This will give the younger players like Noah, Gray, Tyrus and Thabo much needed more floor time to see what they're made of.

Cleveland should have thrown Shannon Brown in the deal. They aren't playing him anyway.

Roman responds: I think he is.

I dig this....this is huge for DaBulls...Thank God I didn't call Paxson names....sorry to those who did..gotta be feelin pretty special about now..lol...I was wondering what he was doin, tho....I gotta admit...

I think he showed he thought about this...and I just added Paxson to my spell check dictionary...DaBulls and Sefalosha, too

Larry Hughes (I'm a big fan) and Sefalosha in the back court is a huge upgrade...and our front court just got solid by opening up more minutes for some guys we all wanna see play...I imagine Paxson did too.. as well.. also.. (that's a triple positive, btw)...

ok..I'll tune in...I think the playoffs are a lock, now

CONGRATULATIONS DAN DAKICH!!!

I'm not ready to enshrien Paxson in the Hall of Fame, but this is a deal that had to happen. Sorry to see Smith go, but he was on a one year deal, and most likely would not have been brought back next year. Wallace was a cancer the Bulls clubhouse, and frankly I would have taken a Ham Sandwich for him. I'm just sorry Pax has been asleep at the wheel for the last six weeks, and he just woke up to realize there was a deadline today.

Yes, it's about time Pax got up of the bench and got back into the game. This is a good trade. Good bye Big Bent!

Horrible!!! Blocks Tyrus Thmas and Thabo's bid for more playing time. Paxson missed the boat and then reacted too late. Bulls are the a mess!!

I'm confused as to how Wally Szczerbiak is included in this deal. What does Seattle get out of this? If I were another team, I wouldn't take Adrian Griffin for a can of beer. Also, why couldn't Duhon be involved in this trade?

It sounds good, but with Larry Hughes more than likely starting, how does Gordon, Sefalosha fit into the equation? Gooden will get the start meaning Tyrus minutes will be around the same, with Gray and Noah receiving more minutes. I guess time will tell. I believe overall the Bulls will be better, younger, but better. Wallace I think had maybe 2 more decent years. Joe Smith probably is playing his best ball in his last 5 years. I think the bulls will miss him more then anything.
gooden PPG 11.3 RPG 8.30
hughes PPG 12.3 RPG 3.60

I guess the new line-up will be :

HINRICH
HUGHES
DENG
GOODEN
GRAY

I believe in the long run, Gray will be a better player then Wallace, but for now Cleveland just got stronger.

Interesting that we get Hughes now, when we could have had him since 2000 when Sleuth Krause traded Kukoc to the 76ers. Instead, Mr. "organizations win championships" opted to let Hughes go to Golden State for John Starks (never played a game for us) and a future draft pick. Anybody recall who we got for that? Probably somebody who's flipping burgers somewhere today. Not that Pax hasn't made similar bonehead trades -- let's see, who did we get for Tyson Chandler? Could it have been all stars like P.J. Brown (retired) and J.R. Smith (who he let go to the Nuggets for nothin')?

Big Ben had to go- true, but there has to be more to this trade. Now we have 3 power forwards and no one who can defend the center position. (Don't tell me Gray is the answer.) Hughes is a legit 2 and should not be forced to play the point (he's not). What does this mean for Thabo? Back to riding the pine once Deng is 100% healthy I presume? Does this mean we are committing to Hughes and getting rid of Gordon? We can't pay two shooting guards over 10 mil per year.

I would understand this trade more if Hughes or Gooden were expiring contracts. Otherwise, I don't see the long term benefits of this one.

I'm no Drew Gooden fan but at least he can play the post which the Bull needs. We're looking a starting five of Hinrich, Hughes, Deng, Gooden and Noah. Not too shabby. What will happen to Thabo Selfosha? Back to his role coming off from the bench? This will destroy his confidence. We'll see how Jim Boylan could turn around this franchise? Wow, we finally get rid of Ben Wallace. I couldn't wait to see him gone. What a relief.

With Hughes included there is no salary savings. Hughes is awful. Compared to the deals Pax could have made the past year this is pretty sad. I am so down on the Bulls right now.

Oh, how the mighty have fallen. When Chicago things a chronically underachieving Drew Gooden (who is softer than Brad Daughtery) and a rapidly declining Larry Hughes who gets hurt every other game and can't shoot barely 30% (see www.tradelarryhughes.com) are positive additions then the city has lost all basketball sense. You think Wallace didn't have heart, wait until you get your fill of Hughes and Gooden. Tonight all of Cleveland is celebrating because this makes us a lock for the finals again and a lock that Lebron will end his career where it began: in the great city of Cleveland. Just like you enjoyed sticking it to us during the Jordan years, we will be delighted to pay back those years now that you have the softest, most overpaid, most underachieving roster in the league. Have fun!

This is nothing more then a desperation trade. It seems the Bulls originally picked up Wallace to get past the Heat when they had Shaq, but since he's gone they may want to get more mobile with the rest of the teams. This just seems odd. Guess no plans for Ben Gordon in the future and can go after Luol.

I hope this shuts that cynical whiner Mariotti up--I cant stand his griping and attacks on Paxson and the Bulls. Bitching never provides anything positive, so why does the SunTimes continue to support Mariotti's nasty tone toward our beloved sports teams and personalities? You go, John Paxson, it's not easy dealing with the bloated egos in the NBA in 2008 and I think what you just did was awesome for the Bulls! Paxson gets an A...Mariotti continues to get an F-...the smug whiner!

I think this is an outstanding trade. As someone already pointed out, Drew and Kirk are reunited from their Kansas days.

Larry Hughes has been hot of late, averaging 19 ppg in February. He always seems to step up his offensive game near the end of the season. Also keep in mind that Larry Hughes is "insurance" in case Ben Gordon cannot be resigned, as they both are the same player (okay, Ben is a better shooter, I'll give you that).

All in all, very smart move at the deadline for the Bulls. I think both the Bulls and Cavs will benefit. Do not forget, the Bulls also have two first round draft picks coming up this summer. And not to mention, plenty of young talent. (I would like to see us get rid of Noah, a pick and Duhon for a big man like LaMarcus Aldridge or Henderson from T'Wolves).

Its not exactly what kind of trade I was looking for but i'll take it. Seeing Drew Gooden should lift Kirk's spirits. Seeing Ben Wallace go sure did lifted mine! No more of that damn bell ringing in the united center, or the oh lord when he gets the ball in his had. Gooden is 6'10 and a real on the block and perimeter outside scorer. Larry Hughes is a taller Ben Gordon that can play defense. Wouldn't that make him better than Ben Gordon? I'm going to miss Joe Smith, but everyone knew that if he was your best player, what does that say about your team? I'm not sure what the Cavs are jumping up and down about saying that they got Lebron some help.lol. we know the truth. 2 years and Lebron is out! Go Bulls!!!

Ben Wallace was garbage! I'm glad hes gone.. This trade gives Noah & Tyrus a lot more time on the floor. Should help them develop into nice players for the rest of the year.. Hughe's is a nice player, when healthy.. The oldies will be missed as far as bball knowledge but we needed a change! This trade will have me watching again...

Start Hughes and Kirk at gaurds, with Deng, Gooden and Noah.
Off the bench Gordon, Thabo, Nocioni, Thomas and Gray. These two line ups should be able to make some noise in the East for the rest of the season The right situation, you could do both Thabo and Hughes as big guards with Deng , Nocioni and Noah ( think Detroit), overall good to see Bust Wallace go

Allen

This deal is sweet when you think in terms of the next couple of years. We have 2 core players who will become RFA's next season if they don't sign an extension. I believe Luol will be back but I'm not so sure with Gordon. He wants too much money to be so short. He has offensive game but lacks defense and is prone to turn the ball over in crunch time. This deal makes our backcourt much bigger and much better defensively. It gives us insurance in case we can't reach a deal with Gordon. We will take a step back but we now have ammo for a big deal this offseason. Thanks Pax for putting a little on the crap we call the Bulls. And I don't think this changes our chances of making the playoffs. We can still get in the East with our new team. However, I think got CLE got the better end of this deal in terms of winning immediately bcuz cleveland can now contend with boston and the west. BULLS-HIT squad is getting better!!!

Norman sez: "Wallace I think had maybe 2 more decent years."

Really?

I guess this wasn't one of them, huh?

Will 2009 be one of them, or will he decide to extend his vacation ... and take next year off too?

I like Hughes and have 4 years. We had a chance to get this guy when Portland was giving him away a few years ago. Gooden is better than what we had. Overall this was a move of desperation. Paxson is over his head in this position as GM.

Time 2 start looking for a new GM and coach.

As a Cavs fan, I can guarantee you that Cleveland is dancing in the streets with the departure of Larry Hughes. He made his rep as a slasher to the hoop, but can't do it anymore due to injury and has become the worst jump shooter in the league. Bulls fans, get ready to spend time at:
www.heylarryhughespleasestoptakingsomanybadshots.com (It's a real web site).
No web site for Gooden but you'll be tearing your hair out when he follows up a 15 point/10 rebound game with 2 and 2 in 36 minutes. LeBron will straighten out Wallace's attitude. Overall a better deal for the Cavs.

This deal does not help the Bulls and Cavaliers get any closer to challenging the Celtics and Pistons for the Eastern Conference title this season, and it likely moves the Sonics closer to Oklahoma City rather than a spot in the Western Conference playoffs. As for Ben Wallace, he was a disaster from the day he signed a fat contract. He was slow, lethargic and wasn't nearly the rebounder and defensive player he was in Detroit. I'm not so sure he can help LeBron James and the Cavaliers get out of the first round, let alone a return trip in the NBA Finals this June.

Cleveland won big on this deal. They now may be able to scratch with the big two in the East, Boston and Detroit. I'm glad Pax made this deal. His trade to get Wallace was a gamble and he lost. Wallace's lousey attitude in the locker room and lack of heart on the floor became a virus that has spread to the whole team. Sorry to see Joe S. go but this trade gives Bulls fans some hope of the team getting back to the playoffs.

Good deal because of Gooden, Hughes and Brown. We just got better scoringwise in the post and better defensively in the back court.

I am happy to see Ben Wallace go because fans were downright vile. Time for Chicago to see what they have, which is and unfinished product in Gray. And Wallace now has a team he can HELP. Ill, Wallace, Vrajo, and Labron are going to be a force.

My guess is, Thabo will continue to start at the 2. The question is where Ben Gordon will fit.

Actually, who cares? This team is still bad. They're only bad in a different way now.

I can only hope they'll unload at the end of the season. For fans sake, the biggest upside of this trade is dumping Big Ben and giving Noah, Thomas and Gray more time in the rotation to see what they are.

Pretty good trade - Gooden's scoring matches Smith's, and his rebounding matches Wallace's. Plus he's a young guy who played with Hinrich at Kansas (maybe he can revitalize him). Gooden's a banger, something the Bulls haven't had.

Getting Hughes seems to mean Gordon is gone... we're not paying $10+million/year to two SGs... Hopefully Thabo still gets playing time.

Simmons could be an interesting long term project at big...

Noah can handle C... We'll have to see how Gray keeps up... his speed could be a defensive liability... Gooden could also play C, with maybe Thomas at the 4.

In sum - Bulls got a lot more scoring, a good low post scorer/rebounder, and an overpriced 2 who can score.

Bulls lost a good backup PG, a non-scoring overpriced underachieving C, a decent scoring (non-rebounding PF), and Griffin...

Looks like the focus of the draft is going to be PG/C.

Oh Great! Now we got too many guards, and fowards!

Duhon
shannon
thabo
gordon
hughes

WHAT THE HECK!

Pax just got rid of a 60 million, non-free-throw shooting non-leader and got something decent in return. I like Joe Smith going too, because he was a crutch the younger Bulls were leaning on way too much. He brought here to compliment, not to lead games in scoring! I'm interested in the Bulls again.

unless pax does something to really upgrade this off season all of this would be for nothing but he must sign deng and or gordon if not he just made the rival cavs better and the bulls worst but it was a good move to get all of the salaries out of there jury is still out on this one

As I look at the last dismal minutes of that overtime loss to a New Jersey team that was without Jason Kidd; I think about how pathetic it was that the Bulls couldn't close it out in regulation.

Then I look at who was on the floor when the horn went off after four quarters.

Next, I take a peek at the guys who managed all of 8 points in the overtime period.

Finally ... I take into consideration that three of our "premier" players in that game teamed up for 16 personal fouls, to go along with an aggregate total of 35 points. Then I compute the ratio of points to fouls,(taking into consideration the number of points that those fouls cost us at the line on the other end of the court) and I arrive at the conclusion that you could ship the entire lot of them out ... AND STILL LOSE A GAME!

Pax had to do something,Anything..That's just what it was ...Everybody making their teams better and Pax is like a Deer in the headlights.. CAN'T MAKE A MOVE.He's a horrible GM. For one..you will see Big Ben play BIG TIME ball in Cleveland... Ben is a leader and a free spirit. Pax and Skiles was stopping that from day one! You can't wear the headband[what kind of dumb stuff is that!]Then, telling him Kirk is the leader of team.That hurt him big time.That's why you had/have all the problems on the team.[Kirk can't lead nobody..hardly lead a old lady across the street]then, they tell Ben how to workout..when..put those weights back inside/we don't do that here Ben. So, They lost him. Ben is happy he's gone. WHAT you think Gray is the answer..He's a Big Poluka!

Horrible...Horrible...Horrible. Pax is making moves cause everybody else is making then. Joe Smith..NO! You had P.J. Brown,and J.R. Smith..What was wrong with those guys! Now what about Thabo? For him to get better,he needs playing time...conflick with Larry Hughes. Tyrus needs minutes to get better! Pax is a joke!

This was a decent trade for the bulls immediate needs, but I think paxson still has alot on his plate with decisions on expiring contracts. I still think he has a bigger deal in mind but for right now I mean at least we got a legit post player in grew gooden I think he is good edition and a big option in the bulls system. Grew will make a big impact and will relieve some pressure from the perimeter game. I have not been to big on larry hughes since traded to cleveland to help lebron. I know he has had some good years though becuase he always gave the bulls gaurds big trouble when playing for the wizards so hopefully he can stay healthy step in and give us a big contribution on the wing. Im not sure what the player rotation is going to look like now but it should be intersting with a potential starting 5 of kirk,larry,luol,grew,and ? (noah or gray) its going to be hard to shuffle larry and ben gordan becuase they both demand shots. As of right now ben should be good coming off the bench for his shooting it will keep larry a little fresher and stop putting all the pressure on ben to score so much. Over all im pleased for now im going to miss the good effort joe smith brought every night. Ben wallace was definitly on a decline and will never be in the form he was in detroit so this should reignite some fire in the bulls offense looking forward to seeing to bulls in the playoffs

At least it's a start. Like almost everyone out here, I feel the key was getting rid of Wallace. Now in the off-season they may be able to make some moves.
Watch what Wallace will do now he's with Lebron. You won't recognize him he'll play so well.
It will truly tell what a SCUMBAG he really is. I also think it won't be long before he starts talking smack about the Bulls as an orginization

As I look at the last dismal minutes of that overtime loss to a New Jersey team that was without Jason Kidd; I think about how pathetic it was that the Bulls couldn't close it out in regulation.

Then I look at who was on the floor when the horn went off after four quarters.

Next, I take a peek at the guys who managed all of 8 points in the overtime period.

Finally ... I consider the fact that three of our "premier" players in that game teamed up for 16 personal fouls, to go along with an aggregate total of 35 points.

Then I compute the ratio of points to fouls,(taking into consideration the number of points that those fouls cost us at the line on the other end of the court) and I arrive at the conclusion that you could ship the entire lot of them out ... AND STILL LOSE THE GAME!

This is the best day for the franchise since that June day in Utah when Michael posed for his final finest moment as a Bull. Thats how good it feels to get rid of Wallace. I was among the small minority that dreaded the Wallace singing before it ever happened, because I knew it meant the end of Tyson Chandler in Chicago.

Now Noah and Gray can share time at center and develop for next year.

I am glad to see Joe Smith go, because he only took time away from the development of Thomas. Unfortuneatly, Gooden likely will do exactly the same thing. However, Gooden is a better, tougher player than Smith, so I can live with that. This allows us to trade either Thomas or Gooden with Gordon and Hinrich for a real point guard in the offseason.

I like the Hughes acquisition because it adds more size to our backcourt rotation, and it means that Gordon is definately out with the Bulls during this summers trade season. Can't wait to get rid of that mope a dope spastic clutz.

Have to go the ESPN.com to check out the salary cap ramifications of Hughes and Goodens contracts long term. They make $20 million per this season.

This definately makes the Bulls better immediately and gives us much better trade flexibility in the immediate future.

Great(not just good) Riddance to one of the 2 mope a dope Bens, can't wait for the other shoe to drop. I hope Gordons wrist falls off for the rest of the season so I don't have to watch him rumble stumble and bumble all over the court every night. Sitting actually helps his trade value, if he has any with his insane contract demands.

Maybe the rest of the season might be worth the cost of the NBA ticket, the first part sure wasn't

This was a good trade for the bulls and not so great for the cavs. The bulls get bigger in the backcourt and add a scoring option in the starting line up in hughes. The problem is that there are not enough minutes to go around for everyone. The bulls now have 6 guards (pg- hinrich, duhon, sg- gordon, hughes, thabo, brown.) Hinrich, gordon, and hughes are going to play big minutes which leaves few minutes for thabo and duhon. Shannon brown may be a hidden gem in this deal and I'm sorry but thabo is not a point guard. As for the front court, I wouldn't expect to see Gray often if at all unless matchups warrant it. I don't know what everyone sees in gray but i don't see much. Yes he has size but, he is soft, slow, and not very strong for a guy his size, so i'm not on that band wagon. But i see the rotations in the front court to include noce, deng, tyrus, noah, and gooden. I just don't see how gray will fit in. I believe we can play more up tempo with this team which we like doing and gray just doesn't fit. If I were coaching the line-up would flow like this:

Starters-------Reserves

Hinrich--------Duhon
Hughes-------Gordon/Thabo
Deng-----------Nocioni
Gooden-------Thomas
Noah-----------Gooden/Thomas

Any trade that gets Wallace out of a Bulls uni is a good trade. Although the trade cost the Bulls Joe Smith and Adrian Griffin, I think the absence of Wallace will more than make up for anything that the Bulls lost.

And what did the Bulls lose with Joe Smith and Griffin anyway? Hughes averages almost 10 points more than Griffin does, and Gooden equals Smith's scoring numbers and surpasses him in rebounding.

And Wallace is gone. Finally.

YES!!!

Yay.....Shannon Brown???

The Bulls gained 30pts and 11 rebounds in this trade and a guard (Hughes) who can create his own shot.

Now Paxson can reward (low ball) Deng and Gordon for turning down 10 mil a year. And if any team bids over 8 mil a year, Pax can sign and trade.

Excellent tactical move by Paxson to upgrade the overall talent and ensure he doesn't over pay for marginal NBA talent.

"Just like you enjoyed sticking it to us during the Jordan years, we will be delighted to pay back those years now that you have the softest, most overpaid, most underachieving roster in the league."

Bill - you seen Wallace play lately? hahahaha

This is the best trade made by a Chicago team since Hundley for Grzlanek and Karros. Good riddance to Ben Wallace!!! Now, I like our chances to win a few games and compete one of the last playoff spots

Sorry to see Joe Smith go, but getting rid of Wallace was huge. And just to think, the Bulls traded away Tyson Chandler for cap room. Oh well.

I like the trade. I can't believe anyone took that Ben Wallace contract off the bulls hands. I agree with an earlier blog that Wallace will play better now, but he was a negative for this team. He couldn't score, had a horrible free throw percentage and a bag field goal percentage as well. He didn't rebound as well nor block shots anymore. Plus the fact he was costing the Bulls a fortune for all that. Hughes contract is almost as bad and runs the same length. When healthy he is a good player, but he gets hurt every year and misses a lot of games. Joe Smith played better than I thought. Drew Gooden can replace him and his contract runs out the same time as Smith's and he is younger and doesn't have the knee problems. The others were just throw-ins who won't get much playing time as I see it. I would have to say that Paxton has admitted Ben Wallace was a fiasco and that this year is a lost year. They did get younger and more importantly have a chance to develop guys like Noah, Thomas, and Gray up front. I hope they continue to play Sefolosha as he could be a very good player in this league. I think they may finally let go of someone in the off-season. Most likely Gordan in a sign and trade. I can't see him getting 10 million now. He should have taken the money and run. Deng won't get 10 mil either. I bet both are regretting that move.

More like Bye Bye Joe Smith!!

its funny to read the comments on here compared with what people are saying here in cleveland, chicago fans couldnt wait to get rid of ben wallace, and its the exact feeling cavs fans had about hughes. so its kinda like we just swapped headaches.

drew gooden has underachieved in cleveland and has been very incosistant, most fans dont mind seeing him go. However when he's on he can be good and almost great. maybe the change of scenery will help him continue to develop.

cedric simmons never played no one really cares.

shannon brown however has a chance to be really good if he can earn some steady playing time and continue to work on his d and jumper. he is extremely explosive, ive seen him do some of the sickest dunks ive ever seen during warmups at the cavs games.

Starting line-up should be: Thabo, Hughes, Thomas, Gooden, and Gray, because thats who have earned a start. If Boylan and Pax want to keep their jobs they need to get as far as they can away from Kirk Hinrich. EVERYONE is to blame but the point guard. EVERYBODY else's point guards are pivotal parts of their offenses and teams, but ours gets a pass. And that is the only context you can use with the words Kirk and pass.

Im gonna withhold judgment on this trade for a minute...

I wouldnt consider this a blockbuster though, it may be more of addition by subtraction.

We do got lots of young, good character, college all american, core hustle guys!!!

THE KIDABULLS!

(hey didnt Hieny and Gooden play together at Kansas?)

Kieth sez: "I am happy to see Ben Wallace go because fans were downright vile."

I'm also happy to see him go; because now you can finally stop massaging that limp and lame, "Ben Wallace chubby" that you keep hidden in your BVD's.

Not that we really want to see it.

D. Green sez: " For one..you will see Big Ben play BIG TIME ball in Cleveland... Ben is a leader and a free spirit."

What Ben is, (unless you care to discuss what the meaning of "is" is) is an overpaid sloth, who cashed in on the "luck of the draw"
which allowed him to win a championship ring in Detroit.

He was a smaller part of that championship season than most people are willing to admit, but he'll gladly take your money anyway, and say ... "Thank you very much".

Well this trade gets rid of a problem, but brings little in the way of solution. Wallace was weak offensively, but strong defensively when we got him from the Pistons. Since all of his nagging injuries, he's been a liability on defense too. So recently he has had zero redeeming qualities. Getting Hughes on a team that has way too many front court players already makes NO SENSE. And he shoots it up more than a heroin addict. Unless one or two of our guards/fwds are trade bait in the off-season to package and get us a stud (which a market like Chicago deserves...passed on Kobe, Garnett, Gasol - come on), then I have to question the decisions being made of late by Pax and Reinsdorf. I love Gordon, but he's too small and kills us on D. I love Heinrich, but he's too inconsistent and turns it over too often (as a KU grad, I can tell you he's no different now than he was then). I love Deng, but he won't take over a game down the stretch when we need a no. 1. Duhon is a solid back-up point, and Tabo needs more time to develop his game offensively and fully understand the NBA v. International. I don't like getting rid of Joe Smith. I know he's older, but still had plenty of gas in the tank...who in the hell is going to give us his steady low post/swing game? Gooden, please. Again, as a KU grad, I've watched his game since his freshman year and he does nothing great...particularly where the Bulls have noted weaknesses. Noah will be solid, but he's got to put on at least 15-20 lbs of muscle. Grey is too green and soft at the moment. The future, with a few more strong low post guys, looks good. The short term doesn't excite me. Skiles would have been the perfect fit for that type of team. Boylen is not the answer. Team plays hard but can't finish. We need finisher(s).

After taking a sec to digest this deal, I really like it. Moving a player (wallace) with a 15 mil price tag and no offense game isn't easy but Paxson pulled it off. Everyone keeps talking about Larry Hughes, I don't see him being here to finish his contract, and moving him with hopefully be less of a task then finding a suitor for Wallace. As for the other parts of the deal. Drew Gooden is a legit Power forward. He plays old school power forward and that's what the Bulls needed. Shannon Brown is my favorite part of the deal. Us Bulls fans have longed for a taller guy at the two, that was move of a slasher. Plus, Brown is the pride of Illinios, A former Mr. basketball at Proviso East. I really like his addition and hope Paxson resigns him this summer. Cedric Simmons is young, Athletic and a little undersized at the Power forward. Wait a minute am I talking about Tyrus Thomas or Cedric Simmons. But seroiusly I think if the Bulls can resign him for a smaller deal then Thomas that would make Tyrus a valuable trade piece this of season. This trade has helped the Bulls better then any of the teams involved.

The Ben Wallace Cubby..thats good Mark V

Too bad we had to give up Smith but u know he was a must if someone was to take on brutal ben.
The only way this team gets better is if they somehow can do a sign and trade (probably pix and another player) with Gordon in the offseason for a low-post guy - wait, didn't LA get give up garbage for the same thing?

Man...we suck

Ok finally Paxson got rid of some of his trash. Paxson is STILL a mope who is in OVER-HIS-HEAD!!! I see folks are rejoicing at the trade, well, if Paxson had any Managerial acumen, Wallace wouldn't have been on the Bulls in the first place, AND if Paxson had any
Managerial acumen he would have went to reinsdorf and said this Team Needs Gasol, and perhaps Reinsdorf would have got off his rump and okayed the deal.
Paxson does not the the guts and fortitude to do such deals which makes him INCOMPETENT! in my my mind. It amazes me how folks are giving PAXSON A PASS!!!
Now, the Bulls will have a lineup of SOFT, Gutless and Clueless players, who have great pedigree, but no Moxey.
This entire franchise is a mess!!! in the meantime FANS FILL THE STADIUM, THE BULLS come up with CATCHY SLOGANS marketing ploys, while Reinsdorf rakes in MILLIONS.

WE ARE getting HOSED by the BULLS!

BTW did you see the Bulls just give away a game on Wednesday to New Jersey??? Made me sick to my stomach

Kathleen sez: " Now, I like our chances to win a few games and compete one of the last playoff spots."

Now, (just as before) I like our chances for a lottery pick in the draft.

Getting rid of Ben Wallace automatically makes it a good trade. He never seemed to give 100% and his contract was an albatross for us. I hated to see Joe Smith go, he was solid but I'm sure he was essential for the deal to be made. It frees up money and gives us a low post presence in Gooden (we still need a 'true' big man) and a shooter in Hughes (as well as insurance should Ben Gordon leave). I'm not jumping up and down about this deal but I do feel we're a little better now than we were yesterday.

If injured stars have to earn their way back into the starting lineup then these new guys should have to do the same. Thabo has been doing a great job and it would be ridiculous for him to lose his spot to Hughes. Right now, I think it would be best for the bulls to stick to some kind of rotation and give all guys as much time as possible on the court to help evaluate what should be done over the summer.

Starting 5
Kirk, Thabo, Nocioni, Deng, and Noah

Gooden should be the first forward off the bench for Nocioni while Thomas comes in for Deng. Gray relieves Noah. Hughes comes off the bench for Thabo and Gordon/Duhon cover for Kirk.

Ben Wallace is even more overpaid than Keith Van Horne who is making 4.3 million just to show up for practice for 30 days in NJ. Good bye Ben and Good riddance. How are the Bulls supposed to win when it was 4 vs 5 everytime Wallace was out of the floor?

Just three days ago I was telling everyone to quit hootin' and hollerin' about Wallace because unless someone needed him in a special situation he wasn't going anywhere.

Thank you Cleveland!

When you have instant offense like Lebron, and a player unwanted in Cav country as much as Larry, the skies open up and miracles do happen.

I'm not sure this didn't just fall into Paxsons' lap, so I'll reserve my praises. One thing for sure is, we done good. We done real good. No star, but the baggage release is a load off everyones chest.

I'm past the 'cryin' for a star' phase, 'cause I knew it wasn't happening, but this trade makes us a little better, but even more, it gives us much greater trade leverage for the future.

I hope Hughes has a second wind. He's the big scoring guard everyone's been asking for, and Shannon might benefit from some home cookin'.

I'm sorry, but Cleveland got older, not better. I'll take it!

Now, let's see what happens now that the Cavalry has arrived?

Let's see. John Paxson makes a trade with the organization that his brother use to be the GM.

1. Did the Bulls get a low post player? No

2. Did the Bulls get a big shooting Guard? No

3. Did the Bulls get some salary cap relief? No

4. Did the Bulls gain any further draft picks? No They actually lost a second round pick.

Paxson is not a good GM. He is on the verge of losing Deng and Gordon. WOW!!!!!!!

I miss Jerry "Crumbs" Krause!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The perfect senario? Let Gordon and Deng ride the pines while watching their free agent value tank. They haven't been too interested in playing this year, anyway. Gooden is a good replacement with Joe Smith's departure. Nocioni and Thomas can fill the SF role while Hughes, who can actually create his own shot and get it off over a longer 2 guard, can play the 2 with Hinrich and Sefolosha rotating at the guard position. Big Ben, we hardly knew ye, only enought to know you're old and bad. Have fun getting abused by either Garnett, Bosh, or Howard in the playoffs. And King James, be careful what you wish for.

This would have been a good move even if the Bulls had traded Wallace for a dirty mop bucket.
By the way... I met Tyrus Thomas today in a Jewel grocery store and he seems to be a very decent guy.
Wallace was a cancer and a bust as a player. Good riddance loser.

Roman responds: I interviewed Tyrus once on the phone, and I agree, he seemed cool. Hard to judge though on a brief call.

http://heylarryhughespleasestoptakingsomanybadshots.com

Funny site. I know Pax made a good trade.

Please will someone trade PAX MAN. No disrespect, he is not the MAN to run the BULLS.

Great trade! I think that Ben has had a negative effect on the whole team. If he didn't play, he depressed the whole team. I think the team needed another big 2 guard and we got Hughes. He should play better with the Bulls. We now have a balanced guard situation with Thabo able to play a little 3. We get younger, trade Gordon in the summer and have Gooden to replace Smith who seems to be falling apart. I like Noah better than Wallace. I just hope the team develops the killer instinct they lost.

I actually like this trade better than the alternative (not love, just like). I along with the rest of Chi-Town am relieved to see Big Ben and his fro go. I'm intrigued by the two YOUNG players that aren't getting much mention in this trade; Shannon Brown and Cedric Simmons. Shannon dunks on any and everybody that gets in his way (HUMAN HIGHLIGHT REEL/CHECK HIM OUT ON YOUTUBE), and Cedric is a raw big with an interesting up side. My major concern or question mark would be our two guard positions. At the moment we have seven guards on our roster out of our 15 spots (Kirk Hinrich, Ben Gordon, Larry Hughes, Chris Duhon, Thabo Sefolosha, Shannon Brown, & JamesOn Curry). Even though I'm sure Shannon Brown & JamesOn Curry will not see the floor much; theirs still not enough minutes to go around. I hope the U.C. brain trust can find meaningful minutes for Thabo; and enough basketballs for Larry & B.G. I really feel indifferent with the Joe Smith/Drew Gooden swap. I'm a Joe Smith fan along with every other Bull's fan I know, so Gooden will be heavily scrutinized to see if he can contribute equally or better at the four spot. They say Larry is a ball hog with his own website; well know he's on a team that can afford to bench him when he gets out of hand. I think he will realize that and work to find himself higher percentage shots; but maybe not... Time will tell. One thing is for sure Jim Boylan has got his hands full in this would be coaching audition... Thanks Johnny Jumpshot (I LOVE THE EFFORT!!!)

Long term, better deal for the Bulls. The keys here are Gooden, Shannon Brown, and Cedric Williams. Gooden is a considerable upgrade over Wallace, who played hard when he felt like it. Brown and Williams are both 2006 1st round picks who have good upside and have not really been given a chance. If they develop, it is a steal for the Bulls. If not, it is still a decent deal because we got rid of Wallace.

Larry Hughes costs a bit less than Wallace, and has a nice upside if gets healthy. He is an obvious message to Ben Gordon - your services are overrated and you won't get the contract you were hoping for. I know people don't like Hughes contract, but in the NBA contracts need to be about equal in cash to make a deal. Given the choice of keeping Wallace, who simply hasn't played with any intensity, this is a no-brainer.

The Bulls just got a lot younger, and are looking at upside again. Cavs got the better deal in the short term, though. Smith is a a good scorer, and my bet is that Wallace makes a big come back with a winning team - proving it was simply lack of effort here that caused his decline.

First and foremost any trade that removes Ben Wallace from the Bulls roster is by definition a great trade. Even better I no longer ever have to think about him, say or type his name ever again. Now having said that what the Bulls got in return were two mediocre players, one of which is dramatically overpaid (Hughes), Gooden who is an underachiever and two warm bodies. The only way this trade helped the Bulls was by getting rid of Wallace! Damn it, that will be the last time I type his name! Gooden will give them some support at the 4 but he is not a full time starter or a great 4, if he was the Cavs wouldn't have dumped him. Hughes is bad news, chronically hurt, a ball hog and more interested in his tatoos than winning basketball games. He needs to go along with his salary in the off-season. This trade doesn't change the fact that the Bulls are rebuilding and need to play their young players. Even if they limp into the play-offs so what? They'll just be eliminated in the first round. Use the young guys: Start Gray at 5, Noah at 4, Thomas at 3, Deng at shooting guard and Hinrich at point. Give these guys a chance to develop and work together and I believe they can compete in this league. Work in Gooden at 5 and 4, Nocioni at 3, Thabo/Gordon at 2 and Duhon at point. Paxson now has to hire Carlisle or Van Gundy now and let them develop the Team for next year. If not Pax needs to go and they can hire a real GM. In the meantime it is still a great day for the franchise to get you-know-who out off the Team!!! We have a glimmer of hope!!

This trade is good for one reason. Salary Flexibility. Ben Wallace's contract was very hard to move. He is on the wrong side of 30, has no offensive game, and declining stats. With his contract gone, the Bulls have options for the future.

Let's see how a bigger backcourt of Hinrich and Hughes works. How about Gordan and Hughes for a stretch? Gooden has the best post skills since we had Curry. I think it's worth seeing how these new players pan out. The beauty is, if any of these guys are not working out, all of their contracts are tradable.

Trades are determined more by salaries than talent. The Bulls can clear cap space in a hurry and make a run at a good free class in '08, '09, or '10. Keep in mind, all of the core players are less than 26 years old. They have time.

this trade needed to happen. paxson had to do something. firing skiles needed to go further. wallace is not right for the bulls at this time. he probably isn't right for cleveland either. gooden is a good pickup. i like the move and think that they are moving in the right direction. i still think skiles is the right coach for this team. any chance he'll be back?

Ten Years. That's how long it will take for this franchise to possibly become a contender. Let's not kid ourselves any longer. Paxson is in over his head. Did you see Brandon Roy in the all star game. Paxson has taken his shots and missed.

Game Over.

This was a good trade. Wallace would have been untradeable this summer and the bulls would have been stuck with him for the duration.

i don't think hughes is a paxson type of player. he's just salary filler for this deal. at least, this gives the bulls more options this summer. the cavs were stupid enough to take wallace, some team will be stupid enough to take the equally bad hughes this summer. i think the bulls would be smart to treat hughes like tim thomas...relegate him to the bench. chicago needs to let thabo continue to start. gooden should be the first big off the bench. tyrus thomas needs to start and go back to the four and focus on developing an inside game rather than trying to be an 18-foot jump shooter.

as much as i don't like gooden and hughes, i think this is addition by subtraction. wallace was an uninspired punk, who thought he was a superstar because he got paid superstar money. now if the bulls could only get rid of hinrich, i would be really happy.

Robey | February 21, 2008 06:43 PM - Good Honest Post.

There are about 4 posters who would dare tell the truth about our point guard - while in the same sentence criticize another team's point guard who happened to TORCH Hinrich.

Mark - the only bad part about this trade is that the first time little Ben gets 10 pts and 13 rebounds, Keith will litter this blog with his normal, ill-conceived babbling...and then lay the blame on the white man (ie Kirk, Paxson, Skiles, Reinsdorf, etc)

First of all kudo's to Pax for keeping this one under his hat till the last minute and avoiding more trade rumor discourse in the locker room.

To the individual that said LeBron will straighten Wallace's attitude out, pass that doobie over here please!

The Bulls got better by simply getting rid of Wallace to begin with. They also have put themselves in better position for off season trade capabilities. They also now have other options in the 4th quarter besides Gordon. Although this trade is not going to get the Bulls to the eastern finals, it does provide some hope for the future.

To the Cav's fans that are jumping up and down for joy, that will help get you in shape to jump up and down demanding Wallace's head on a platter in the near future.

Bill Sez..
"Just like you enjoyed sticking it to us during the Jordan years,

Its wasnt just you buddy....it was the whole league, we took no more enjoyment out of trouncing your team than we did anyone elses team. Baring NY or Detroit!

wow! more second rate free agent pick ups, how surprising. let the rebuilding begin! kool aid for everyone. this organization is a joke. Reinsdork is the worst. his penny pinching and lack of vision is killing this teams future. how many years will we have to watch this foolishness go on. its like the movie "Ground Hog Day" where no matter what happens you wake up and it is the same thing over and over. I blame the "gulliBull" fans and weak media for allowing this to continue to happen. when Jay Mariotti's ranting starts to make sense you know we have hit rock bottom.

We all know the jury is out on this one but let's put a few things in perspective;

1) Ben Wallace gone.

2) I'll miss Joe Smiths' professionalism and overall strong play this year, but he wasn RARELY a factor in the fourth quarter.

3) Thabo can spell at the THREE(3) pretty much 50% of the time. He'll get his minutes and Duhon should be shuffled DOWN.

4) Fresh air for all involved. I like our possible new fresh attitudes and younger legs a little more than the Cleveland side.

5) Scoring should actually be a lot more balanced, especially in the Bulls achilles second quarter. Free throw and shooting percentage should rise.

6) I worry about the post 'D', but this will give the detractors a clearer chance to see if Wallace had the intangibles people might not have recognized, or if his overall play just hampered our game. Other than Tyrus and Thabo, no other Bull takes exception to an opponent CRUISING down the lane. I take exception to that!

O.K. kids, it's all yours.

Mark Villano | February 21, 2008 06:38 PM

Guess what Mark, I get to root for Wallace with Cleveland who has the horses to make Wallace a key contributer. And because of this trade I am picking Cleveland to return to the finals. Folks want to blame that man for being on a team with marginal talent and a sad point guard. And the fans think Scott Skiles is a hall of famer or something. He is a garbage can joker, just like the point guard. And that is primarily why Marcus Williams toasted him. Why don't yall cry about that??? That's Thabo's or Gordon's fault now huh? You stick with Himlich and I will stick with Wallace and we shall see who will be watching in late May and June.

This should serve as proof that the Bulls organization has no idea what they are doing and/or what direction the team is headed.

The trade did nothing for me. It was GREAT to see Ben Wallace go. I think he was a cancer and energy drainer. It would have been terrific if we could have gotten rid of Gordon and Hinrich in the process. Gordon could have some value this summer via sign-n-trade, but I'm pessimistic if we will get any takers for Hinrich. We might be stuck with him.

Someone pointed out the significant role of pg in the NBA and we don't have a solid pg. Hinrich is slow, can't finish at the rim, prone to turnovers and silly fouls, and his jumpshot is whack. He is not a starting pg in the NBA! Neither is Duhon or Thabo!
However, we need to develop Thabo. He is young and I like his upside. I see the most improvement out of Thabo and Noah with increased playing time.

My suggested starting five will probably not be all that popular, but I say we should start:

Thabo
Hughes
Deng
Gooden
Noah(Gray is not dedicated!)

Tyrus and Gordon should get significant minutes off the bench. My top priority this summer would be trading up in the draft using Gordon and Hinrich as bait. I wouldn't hesistate to trade Deng or anyone else for that matter!

We get it....Himlich sucks Keith....NO ONE is saying he is great.

He is serviceable at best. Characther Guy...Heady floor general type.

I would take Deron Williams, Ron Paul, Dude from Golden State, Bibby, chauncy, Nash, or Kidd over him in a heart beat.

But they are not available....

Maybe if little Gordon leaves Indiana (if they fire Sampson), he can just come to the Bulls as a free agent.

Why did the Sun Times run a photo of T-Mac for Larry Hughes on the back page of the paper?

Anthony Navarro | February 22, 2008 09:33 AM - GREAT POST!!!! And I am happy for Paxson. People can also get off his back. I support ALL of his decisions, even moving Wallace. He didnt just dump the guy he at least brought in a decent post scorer.

Jason | February 22, 2008 08:05 AM - PAXSON knows who fault this mess is - its the Coach who quit and had everyone in the DOGHOUSE. Ben Wallace who didnt bring it. Ben Gordon, who didnt defend as a starter.

But ole Himlich is running out of excuses! The clock is ticking, tick tock tick tock! We have all of these big men - and NOONE to get them the ball. We have a defensive specialist for our point guard - who can ONLY guard 2 guards.

Thats right Jason - get ready because you already know Ben Wallace is going to bring it in Cleveland. And all of you malcontents who are angry because he wouldn't CARRY Himlich and crew - too bad. I don't blame Wallace. Working out pretty good for him I think. AND I CANNOT WAIT TO SEE GRAY AND NOAH, with an opposing Center just going beserk! Its what Chicago deserves.

bculz; Isn't Ron Paul running for President? You mean Josh Paul? LOL. Maybe you did mean Ron Paul, because he probably could play on this team!!

this trade is good for one sole reason: ben wallace is no longer on the team. Ben wallace had no business playing 30min. a game for the bulls. He is a liability on offense, and has drastically declined in his rebounding and defense. In reality what good was he to the bulls? What other player gets paid 15 mil. when they are the worst offensive player in the league (besides theo ratliff)? The bulls no longer have to adhere to ben's demands to see touches in the post, nor do they have to see him airball free-throws and do fade away jump-shots that clang off the side of the backboard. Now with the trade the bulls can actually play their more talented, younger, and less paid big men such as noah, thomas, and gray. All of which are better on offense, can still play good defense (besides gray) and rebound. now i am not happy about getting larry hughes or drew gooden, but i am not pissed off either. hughes has the potential to be a good role player despite his lack-luster attitude and large contract. gooden is young and has some post moves, however he is a headcase. This trade could and should work if the bulls decide that they should run and play a more up-tempo game. they now have the players and the depth to do that, yet it is still to be seen if the bulls coaches have any sense of how to run an offense and a team. In all, i hope the bulls play their young players, and continue to lose. what would be the point of making the playoffs when you are under 500 and will only lose in the first round to the celtics or pistons? The best possible scenario would to be in the lottery and have a chance of getting another great young player, or trading that pick for a solid veteran/all-star.

Garnett. Kobe. Gasol. Marion? Kidd? All these *superstar* players were available and we have the pieces to pull off a trade for most of them, yet we don't get it done. Why? Really simple:
1) Paxson is in love with his "core" players and wouldn't part with any of the *non-superstars* to get a legitimate *all-star*. (Remember what's it's like to have all-stars on the Bulls Chicago?)

2) And Reinsdorf is the worst owner in the NBA, not nearly as interested in basketball as his dear baseball team, and treating the historic Bulls franchise simply as a crude business. With no desire to tip-toe in luxury tax to pull off the Gasol trade, and probably a few others, he has failed the fans (while over charging us and hiking ticket prices).

Bulls fans, it's time to come to a sad realization- we were the luckiest franchise in the world in the 90's, having landed MJ and co and getting to watch a true dynasty entertain us for years. But that was an accident; MJ landed on the Bulls lap, and we're far from being treated to that level of sports supremacy again. In the hands of our current owners, the Bulls franchise is hopeless. We need to stop being so loyal to the Bulls- stop watching, reading, purchasing tickets, caring- because their management certainly is not returning the favor.

PS- Way to be loyal to the only player aside from Nocioni who brought it every night this year- Joe Smith.

ha ha ha pax says "he should like us forever, we gave him a nice deal"....... that guy is wonderful. fire him quickly

Culzie - my ire is not directed at you or other objectionable posters, but to those who ONLY want to blame Wallace or Gordon. Thank you for honest forthright conjecture!

But consider your assessment and then how everyone pencils him in all their starting lineups. Duhon and Thabo are better playmakers and ball handlers than this guy.

And I am going to say it like this, Ben Wallace is wearing a Championship ring he EARNED guarding one of the leagues most opposing offensive weapons in history. He was a hair shy of finals MVP, so he really doesnt have to prove to Chicago he knows how to play. We better worry about CAPTAIN KIRK.

Well...you root for Cleveland and the Knicks, and I will worry about the Bulls then. How is that?

You cant root for them all!!

and Kman...

i seriously thought Ron Paul was a hooper.....

ummm...you must not know me....I could tell you who Ron Pauls campaign manager was.

Keith! Stop the Racial stuff. Ben Wallace if he was white,black or whatever still stunk. Go back to watching your imaginary tv. You know absolutely nothing about Basketball.

I went to Suns vs. Celtics game...

NOW THAT WAS INSIDE PLAY!!!

Shaq and Amare'

Twin Towers Squared

They made the Celtics look like the Kidabullz last night.

SUNS are the new favorite to win it all..no question.

Keith you're more fickle than a teenaged girl that falls in love with a different boy every week. First it was Issiah Thomas, then Eddy Curry, then Zach Randolph and the Knicks were gonna dominate. Then it was Boston and Garnett. Now it's Ben Wallace and Cleveland are going to the finals. Loyalty is obviously not in your dictionary (except when it comes to the white sox maybe).
Szczerbiak and West will likely have more impact with Cleveland than ben wallace will have. Cleveland will likely end up as the 3rd seed in the play-offs, it is not inconceivable that the Bulls could end up as even the 6th seed. I would enjoy nothing better then to see that happen and have the Bulls send Cleveland packing then see what your comments would be. I doubt that will happen but it would sure be interesting.

Paul sez: "Keith! Stop the Racial stuff. Ben Wallace if he was white,black or whatever still stunk."

Hear, hear!

great article from simmons on espn.com. says it all.

As for the other big trade this week, kudos to Danny Ferry for somehow getting four of the best five players in an 11-player trade. That has to be some sort of record, right? I already made the case for Wally Szczerbiak and Delonte West helping the Cavs in my Trade Machine piece Wednesday (scroll down to trade 4A), but the Chicago guys pushed the deal over the top for me. First, Drew Gooden needed to go -- he was too inconsistent and too much of a bonehead, and we neared the point when a fed-up LeBron might punch him in the face during a game about three months ago -- and Joe Smith gives the Cavs steadier minutes and reliable production with those minutes. (Maybe Smith's ceiling isn't as high as Gooden's from game to game, but when you have LeBron you need consistency from the rest of the guys more than anything else.) Second, the fact Ferry was able to trade an overpaid guard who actually drove a frustrated Cavs fan to create a site called www.heylarryhughespleasestoptakingsomanybadshots.com and update it every day ... I mean, even if you got back a dead body for Larry Hughes, it would have been a moral victory.

Instead, the Cavs got back the Artist Formerly Known As Ben Wallace, someone who stopped being an elite rebounder and shot-blocker about three years ago, but someone with playoff experience and the ability to defend bigger guys like KG, Shaq or Duncan. He certainly makes more sense for the 2008 Cavs than Larry Hughes did. Anyway, I thought the Cavs could win the East before this trade, simply because none of the Eastern teams have someone who can match baskets with LeBron in a close game. Now? They're the favorites. Look, I love the Celtics, I watch them every game, it has been the most enjoyable season in 15 years. ... But a playoff series almost always comes down to one question as long as both sides are relatively equal:

Which team has the best guy?

Well, LeBron is better than anyone else in the East. So if you were beating Cleveland this spring, it was happening because your supporting cast was significantly better than LeBron's supporting cast. That's why this trade was so dangerous for Boston and Detroit; it shortened the sizable gap between guys 2 through 12 on Cleveland and guys 2 through 12 on Boston and Detroit. Now LeBron has four shooters who have shot 40-plus from 3-point range at least once in their career (Wally, Delonte, Boobie Gibson and Sasha Pavlovic), three seasoned rebounders (Wallace, Smith and Anderson Varejao), a scoring center (Zydrunas Ilgauskas) and, best of all, no Larry Hughes screwing up everything. LeBron is in a much better place than he was last year, and what's even more frightening is that he has been playing out of his mind since last April. I know the Celtics are 41-11, and I know the Pistons have been there a million times ... but still, how could you bet against LeBron in the East when he's playing like this?

Ricky responds: Simmons used to be my guy but i feel like he's lost a bit on his fastball recently. I don't see the Cavs beating the Celtics in the East, and at this point I would almost like the Bulls chances against Cleveland in the playoffs.

"Ben Wallace is wearing a Championship ring he EARNED guarding one of the leagues most opposing offensive weapons in history. He was a hair shy of finals MVP"

The operative word in that statement is "WAS".

Keith - your anger is well known on this board. Now your ignorance is as well! Actually your ignorance was also known - my bad. Mark continues to be quite thorough in exposing your lack of any coherent or intelligent thoughts. Are you like 14?...

Knowledge of ones own Ignorance = Knowledge of Self

Just for the record...

There is what you know

and there is what you know you dont know...

then there is a whole world of things...you dont know, you dont know.

--

The unexamined life is not worth living (Socrates)399bc

--

To know that you DONT KNOW, is the only knowing.
~bc

BEN IS GONE --- BUT BUT WHO IS GOING TO FILL THEM SHOES.///

Ricky you are absolutely insane if you think the Bulls will beat Cleveland in the playoff. Who is going to guard Lebron? Deng? Gimme a break. Cleveland doesnt have to worry because the Bulls wont even make the playoffs bet on it.

Ricky responds: Yeah well the Bulls are real bad, but the Cavs aren't anything special unless these four new guys really work out. Who is the Cavs second best player? Boobie. Boobie? Boobie. I'm sorry but Cleveland can't hang with Detroit or Boston at this point. Though LeBron is playing out of his mind and is now probably the best player in the league. I guess anything is possible if he goes on a tear.

I guess you havent watched the last two years in regards to the playoffs. Who did the Cavs beat in last years playoffs? Let me remind you Detroit. Year before they take them to seven games. And the Cavs have beaten Boston twice already this year and the only time they lost to them was on the road without Lebron and they only lost by 9 points. Second best player is Z not Boobie.

Ricky responds: Alright, cool. No personal vendetta against Cleveland here. So you agree with Simmons that this deal makes them favorites in the East? I'm not saying you are totally wrong, cause it's certainly possible. To me, Detroit is still the best the team in the conference, and their starters could be more fresh this time around with Stuckey, Dixon, Hayes, and maybe even the mysterious Amir Johnson all playing fairly well.

I finally figured it out! Keith Lifetime Southside doesn't really exist, he's just an alter-ego that Ben Wallace made up so he could go on this blog and make positive comments about himself. Otherwise there isn't a basketball fan in the world much less on this blog who thinks Ben Wallace is a great player. I mean c'mon "Ben Wallace came within a hair of Finals MVP". Yeah, sure and the Bears almost won the Super Bowl in 2006.
As for the Bulls. Because that moron Boylan didn't have Wallace around anymore to put in at center for 38 minutes a game thus insuring the Bulls will lose the game, he had to play the young guys. Lo and behold they responded. Noah, Thomas and Hinrich all played well, as I knew they would. If he continues to play them the Bulls will win some games and destroy Boylan's plan to coach so badly the team earns a lottery pick.
The new Bulls are here. All we need to do now is Dump Hughes, play the kids including Gray, hire a real coach and we're set! By the way I'll take Captain Kirk (14 assists against a good team) vs Ben Wallace (37% FG percentage, 41% FT percentage, no defense or rebounding) any day!

A Cleveland sportswriter called it - Hughes and Wallace both had 'untradable'contracts and managed to be traded for each other. Cleveland is desperate to win now and is hoping Wallace can make a comeback. Bulls got two legitimate starters that can stay or be traded; both may actually still be getting playing time in the NBA in 2010, unlike Wallace & Smith. The Bulls need to sort some things out and find some luck to be a top team. They are closer after the trade.

I can speak and stand by what I say and not fold under pressure! Yall let Kirk Hinrich's JOCK go!!! Just let it breathe! Got NOTHIN to do with his color! Paxson, Boylan and Noch are white, I back them because they are doing their JOBS. Unlike our point guard and coach. I can admit that Ben Wallace underachieved, but refuse to dog the guy for not being a scorer when he NEVER has been. And I will NEVER get mad at a MAN for standing up to a Bully. Bulls did the right thing in trading him, but so did Wallace.

Knicks have a team where all of the players are the right size. They never found their chemistry, but you know what...didn't stop them from setting foot in Chicago's backside now did it? And Jamal Crawford crossed Kirk Hinrich so bad Skiles had to call time out to untangle his leggs.

And now yall gone hate on Cleveland - even their fans - who have posted here know the dealeo. I GUESS THEY ARE JUST CRAZY OR RACIST too??? And go ahead and add the Hornets to that list also. Because Tyson Chandler is doing juuuuuuuust fine, NOW THAT HE IS PLAYING WITH A POINT GUARD!!!! I know that much about basketball. And keep holding on to all that hate but while you are doing all of that - take a look at our crappy point guard AND TRY BEING HONEST ABOUT IT.

Hey Ed, you are right, Kirk played great. I see yall can post stats when yall want to. How come you didn't display Hinrich's stats vs. Marcus Williams and the Nets other day? Kirk led all Bulls players with 35 minutes in that game and had 11 points and 6 assists in a loss. Now shall we post all of his stats? I wouldn't do that to you.

He is a good guard and had a great game, but don't start posting like this is Kirk every game. I know yall have started a captain kirk can do no wrong campaign, but all I ask is that yall be fair and honest with your assessments. I see have you have already "dispatched" Hughes - without even seeing the guy suit up. We should just dispose of him like we did JR Smith who silently hung that 43 on us???

Im Starting a Tally..

Everytime someone refers to the BULLS as KIDS!

________________

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So far 14 times on this post.

well let's see the Cav's barely beat the Wizard's friday night and dan cotter has them playing in the finals in june. Seems I recall Dallas was supposed to win it all last year yet Golden State bounced them in the first round and the Pat's were all but crowned Super Bowl champ's til the Giants and Eli manning executed an alomost perfect two minute drill to send them home with their tails between their legs. I will concede the Cav's got better with the trade but not because of Wallace. Szszerbiak and West give them a dimention they didn't have before. The only plus for Wallace is he will be able to roam a bit more on defense with Ilgauskas at center but that still leaves the Cav's basically playing 4 on 5 on offense.

Could it also be that now that Hinrich has some bigs that can do something with the ball besides throw up fade-away bricks from 8 feet away he'll look more like an NBA point guard? Win or lose the Bulls at least will be interesting to watch now. It was funny to read that Noah said Wallace will be missed because of the stories he told yet did not mention his play on the floor.

Hey Culzie, better get ready to tally up a few more 'KIDS' from me. The Bulls just traded the only two older than my oldest, which of course makes it totally natural now.

Im also starting a

Tally for

# of YALL's

Keith Drops when he gets really Angry!

Bulls have improved, and they will be a more fluid team like the Portland Trailblazers or Phoenix Suns pre-Shaq. Even though they should make the playoffs, Pax's moving of the veterans was a white flag of surrender. We are looking to the future, so please give the Bulls another 5-10 years to challenge for the Conference or go to the finals. It will take that much time to develop players and acquire one or two stars. It was the right move to make and I applaud Pax for it. Might as well move Noch on out of here also. There is going to be a big trade/acquistion over the summer.

Culzie I am dying laughing! Thanx!

Ok Keith if'n you're going to use Y'all please put the apostrophy in it so's us good ole boys down south don't get all riled up thinking a yank is tryin to sound like he's spinnin some down home wisdom on some unsuspectin hiller what's missin his front teef. We take as much 'ception to that as we do them thar revenuers lookin fer our shine stills.

Tim I AM DYING laughing.

More lives than a cat.