The Bulls are real bad

First and foremost Richard, let's see how Boylan molds this club. Thirty years of experience has my attention, at least for the moment. Second, the club played half-way decent yesterday. The first quarter had every shot challenged on the 'D' end, a far cry from games past. With the exception of a total brain lapse by Pete Myers early in the second quarter, we play them even 1,3 and 4.

I admire Myers for seeing the need to go to the bench early and often, but how in Petes' name do you have Noc, Griff, Duhon, Noah and Thomas on the floor together. O.K. Mr. Interim Interim, you not only subbed early, but you also got Griffin some deserved time, cool. But to put an offensively challenged five(5) on the court TOGETHER for a game changing period of time just put the most stagnant offensive team in the game today in a brand new catagory, LOST. He's been around long enough for me to say, "That was a BONEHEAD move".

Nocioni had a nice stretch of games about two weeks ago where he mixed up outside/inside that actually helped keep this erratic team in games, but he's back to his old ways again of 'falling in love' with the trey. Personally, I'd have a guy on my bench with a six(6) foot pole with a needle on the end of it. Every time Noc looked at the three while on my end of the court, this guy would stick that needle right 'where it belongs' and send Andres on his way to the bucket, where he really belongs.

Ben Gordon definitely leads the club in one of 'my' catagories. It's called the "What the hell was that" catagory. Every time I watch a Bulls' game and someone takes a stupid, crazy, idiotic, senseless, off-balance shot, I never fail to scream out "What the hell was that". Gordon needs some serious help, 'cause I sure in the heck don't.

Our interior defense could use a dose of Bill Laimbeer tactical training, and the offense could use a few plays (about fifty), but other than that I'll just wait and see if Mr. Boylan can cure the ills. Can't really get much more sick than this.

The Rose Bowl will only serve to depress you more, Ricky. Sorry.

Every single player (besides Duhon who is is usual mediocre self) on this team is having a down year. It's dumbfounding, for the last three years, we have never seen the core three ( Gordon, Hinrich, Deng ) look this miserable.

Mediocre team with mediocre talent
Doesn't play solid defense or draft players who do
Settles for jumpers whenever and wherever

And all those players who were so "against" Skiles really showed up last night against the Spurs.

Maybe they get 30 wins by end of season... maybe.

I've been telling u guys this 4 FIVE long years. John Paxson was a marginal player and a worse GM. U cannot win a title in the NBA with 13 role players and no low post game. This is a CBA team and it starts with Paxson.

The long and the short of it comes down to this and it was proven last night....whether Pete Myers or Jim Boylan is named interim coach you still have a Skiles extension and can expect much of the same thing on the floor. The Bulls need a coach that can run a better offense than the drive and kick throw up a brick offense they are running now. Tyrus Thomas last night had the ball in the corner started to drive and backed out looking for some one to pass to and everyone was just standing around so he drove the base-line again got his shot blocked and was pulled not to return again until the last 2 minutes of the game. Way to go Pete Skiles bench him because he tried to do something while everyone else stood around after the possesion before Ben Gordon dribble the perimeter for 20 seconds then had the ball stripped when he attempted to drive the lane instead of trying to get the ball into Deng on the post or at least getting the ball moving from side to side.

I never thought I would say this but can they get Van Gundy? Despite his 42 regular coat size, he might be able pull this rag tag group of first round draft picks together.

I haven't done the research on the whys or whynots but I'm sure I will be enlightened soon.

Your taking SC in the Rose bowl right Ricky?

What happend to the Great John Paxson? The Chicago Media was kissing his butt a few years ago. When he hired Skiles and refused to go get a legitmate star the hand writing was on the wall. You cant win in this league with just good hustle players, You need a star go to player. The Bulls will not improve much this year and might not make the playoffs too many role players. Where are all the people that were saying the Bulls didnt need Kobe Bryant "were just fine with out him"? I dont hear much from them now. The Bulls are no better now than when Krause ran the team, were back at square one.

If we do not change who starts for this team, we will lose more games than we win. I hate to harp, but Gordon is such a liability to this team, period. And if Wallace is so hurt he can get only 5 rebounds in 35 minutes, what is his worth? I would rather have Sefalosha playing the 2 or even Deng and just sees what happens. Bring Gordon off the bench, he seems to pace himself when he starts, afterburners on when he comes off the bench. Let Noah start as center, better freethower, I think better rebounder, how is he going to learn "D" if he never plays, and he certainly can shoot better. Thomas can start at the 4, but needs to come off the bench in my mind and start Smith.
You will certainly have better defense with Kirk and Thabo as the guards, Smith and Deng forwards and Noah center.
Finally, leave Kirk alone. I have watch at least 200 games since he came to the Bulls. He always tries. Sometimes he fouls too much, sometimes he expects too much on his passes, but never question his desire. I am sure he is about the fourth best point guard out there. there is a reason he was asked to play with USA.

Jeff "the living corpse" Van Gundy?

Never was a fan. Also, I'm not sure he could turn this group around as he always seemed to have a pretty effective low post player wherever he coached. And as we have concluded, the Bulls do not have that player on the roster. He seems to favor a down tempo game and... EGADS!!!! stresses defense. Again, not a Bulls strength.

For the type of team we've assembled (all number two guards and small forwards), get Paul Westhead, an assistant with the SuperSonics. He won't care if they play defense as he focuses solely on offense. Then the starting five would be:

Hinrich
Gordon
Noah
Thomas
Deng

Primary Subs:

Duhon
Nocioni
Sefolosha
Smith/Gray
Griffin

Ride the Bench:

Wallace

The key is to require Noah to bleach his afro each week in a different, shocking color. Perhaps this will help distract the other team (and distract Bulls fans from realizing that we drafted the limited-skills Noah in the first place). The other key is to have Wallace shout insults at the opposing players throughout the game (what else is he good for?). I mean really personal insults. Afterall, who is going to pick a fight with Ben Wallace, aka The Bod? That should be helpful distraction #2.

Roll the ball out and let the Bulls determine their offense on the fly. Team should average about 90 points with this group -- maybe less.

Okay, this is a weak strategy, but at least it might be entertaining. At least as entertaining as what is passing for Bulls basketball right now.

I don't know how any of you can sit and watch an entire game...I've tried...last night, I was flipping between the Blackhawks, Purdue, and the Bulls...

Did everyone see Wiz at the end of the Blackhawks game?

That was sweet...shame he twisted his knee...I'm gonna say it was worth it

Something the Bulls aren't

Two things I forgot to mention there, Ricky O'D.

1) Paxson is as much to blame, if not more, than anyone else for this mess and the N.B.A. World knows it.

2) Your age definitely showed with the assessment of the Bulls being better off as a 'run and gun' squad. You named the ONLY TWO players who would benefit from this style, and 16% qualification equals BIGGER blowouts.

I say, create MUCH MORE space on offense (opens for drives, easier shots and more free throws), play Gray 24 m.p.g. and utilize his low post scoring and kick-out abilities, concentrate as much on proper substitutioning as you do match-ups, and leave double teaming to a MINIMUM. With the lack of a true playmaker, pick and rolls may not be a thing of the past but a need in the future for these guys. Would also love to see Thomas and Noah play MUCH CLOSER to the basket (and you thought Big Ben was a liability outside ten feet?). Good luck Mr. Boylan, looks as though you may be needing plenty of it.

Bulls lost to the Spurs at home. Nothing to be alarmed about. Newsflash - NBA Champions 4 out of 9 years. Pete Meyers knew the dealio. Couldn't have won that game if Red Aurebach was coaching. Boylan is the man. Hope he is smart enough to treat these guys like men, and hope they are smart enough to respond and start playing like they are capable of.

Without a true star, this team is a middle of the pack club. That's what happens when you have a disciplinarian coach. You get a bunch of glee-clubbers that have to rely on hustle, luck and a 100% effort every night or they have no chance. This team was built so that SCOTT SKILES would not have any problems coaching and that is a terrible plan.

Paxson doesn't have to blow the whole thing up, but he does need to assess each position and make sure you have guys with the right size and athleticism to compete. And then one by one start trading off assets to get what you need. I think we can get by this year with our Centers and Forwards. Its the guards that need a major shake-up. Bulls need a bonefide playmaker and a guy who can create his own shot. I would trade a combination of Hinrich, Gordon with another player to get one of those guys. If Jason Kidd is available, I would give NJ Gordon and Hinrich for him. The Bulls need a playmaker first and foremost and then they need that 2 guard. Just about every successful team in the NBA has a great point-guard or two guard. Its not a dominant big man that swings things in your favor. A big man is only as good as the point guard feeding him. And if you don't have a guy that can get to the rim and free throw line, you are missing the necessary element to closing out close games and competing in the playoffs. Jump-shooting teams are doomed in these situations because of the magnified pressure and matched intensity. Until Paxson addresses this small mediocre backcourt, the Bulls will continue to struggle. And it doesn't necessarily have to be a star like Kidd, but a long steady point-guard and a long consistent 2 guard. Someone like Andre Miller and Bonzi Wells could easily fill our needs at those positions. I know its time for Paxson to make an example of the players on this team also - thats Hinrich and Gordon.

KLSS:

In addition to a good starting point-guard and a good starting 2 guard, the Bulls also need a decent back up point guard and a decent back up 2 guard. So they are really four players away from having a competive team -- or 1/3 of their roster has to be turned over. Seems like a pretty big shake up. Not sure that's enough as too many of their forwards/centers are offensively challenged.

Oh well, like Hitman, I have yet to watch a complete basketball game this year (or last year, or the year before... or the year before...). Doesn't look like I will be breaking that string anytime soon.

Chicago sports is OVER. I'm out and keeping my MONEY in my pocket.

Keith, amen to that brother and Gordon should be the first one on the trading block.As Mr. Navarro pointed out he leads the team in the "what the hell was that?" category. He also leads the team in the "I'm Taking this thing in" on one on three situations instead of pulling it back out and running the offense, and loses the ball or gets called for a charge 99 times out of 100. He also leads in the "I'm supposed to take the last minute game winning shot, so I'm not giving this rock up for nothin" category. If gordon actually played with any heart his size wouldn't matter, how many times does A.I. get to the line? Why? Because he plays with heart and drives to rim regardless of who's there and draws the foul while Gordon is content to dribble the perimeter hoping for a screen. Trade Gordon and Wallace and move Deng to the 2 spot with Thomas and Smith at 3 and 4 and Gray in the middle.

Well the good news is that neither of the MEDIOCRE players that Paxson threw huge contracts at took them. You think this year is bad? Imagine the future stuck with an underachieving Ben Wallace AND a soft, underperforming Ben Gordon and Luol Deng...

Sheesh, Wallace is bad enough

Hey everybody, the good news is the Bears season is going to be over and the Cubs start spring training soon.... Thank god i did not subscribe to the NBA package to watch this horrible team, Why do all the Chicago teams suck, damn would be nice if we had owners that had the same passion as the ones in Boston do. I will always be a Chicago sports fan, but it gets harder and harder every year to watch these guys.

So many problems with the bulls, it´s hard to find a place to begin. First, the talent level is just not where it needs to be...first on the list of hacks is Kirk Heinrich...he really should be the first to blame and first to go...of course, there is also Ben Wallace who is a waste. Tyrus Thomas can only do one thing well...dunk. Ben Gordon is a defensive liability who should only be taking open 3´s.

So unless we do some trading....I´d start

PG - Duhon...at least he passes the ball well
SG - Deng...he could use his size to get open jumpers and the occasional post-up
SF - Nocioni- one of the few bulls playing pretty well
PF- Noah---let him learn to play...maybe a poor-man´s tyson Chandler
C- Aaron Gray--This kid is raw, but show´s some offensive game

Bench:

Heinrich, Gordon, Thomas, Griffin, Thabo, Ben Wallace

But as I said, this lineup isn´t going to help all that much, because there just isn´t enough talent

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Ironic that Boylan makes the right decision in bringing Gordon off the bench...which now makes our starting backcourt the worst in the NBA.

Time will tell if Boylan has what it takes. I like the fact that he moved Gordon back to the bench but don't necessarily agree with starting Duhon. Supposedly some of yesterday's practice was spent putting some offensive sets in, hopefully they get the ball going to the rim and not just creating more open 20 foot jumpers. And hopefully we'll see Tyrus and Aaron playing more minutes and see fewer 3 pointers shot early in the clock with no one in any kind of position to rebound. With Boylan's first two games being with the Bucks and the Knicks, both losing teams, he has an opportunity to get a turn-around started which makes me wonder if that was part of the reason Pax didn't have him coaching the Spurs game.

Boylan deserves a period -- like 10 games -- to show us what he's come up with in his years of hoop experience.
(Remember, if the team is still shooting 35%, there's not much he can do.)
Gordon as sixth man is smart.
Will Sefolosha get to work on his game?
Noah is not really an offensive threat; he should be in the game for rebounds and passes.
Hinrich will never be Steve Nash. Stop waiting for it.
Gray should be in there for at least half the game because,
really, come on now -- the Ben Wallace experiment is over.
There was all this talk about who they would deal and that's
your answer right there. A waste of big money, they're
not liable for most of it, and perhaps they can get some kind
of quality player - at any position - for him.

Tim Little - Bulls are going to regret parting ways with Ben Gordon who I feel is distracted more than dogging it. He has been sent to the bench in place of Chris Duhon. I believe that will be enough for Ben to test the waters of free agency. Bulls need to trade him before that happens. Whenever he does go to another squad, we are going to regret it. Ben Gordon is gifted and other teams know it. But this MUST be done because his lack of size and being a defensive liability. 21 points a game is a lot of offense, but its worth the sacrifice if we can get a Rudy Gay type player in here. We need a solid 2 guard.

I faulted Kirk Hinrich more than Gordan because Kirk is the playmaker, team leader, face of the franchise, and more importantly - the player we have PAID. I don't care that he is giving his all everyday. Sometimes you best is not good enough. Skiles is gone and its now time for PAX to stop living through Kirk. Kirk is not Pax - he is not even Skiles. Kirk's a decent player, but his size and handles are killing us. He is supposed to be a cerebral player, but his defensive gambling often takes him and his defense out of games. He is gambling to make up for the athleticism. Bulls need to counter these teams that feature guys with long guards. Pax and Skiles like this little cute Kirk Hinrich stuff - when it is OBVIOUS that our championships were built on the backs of Jordan, Pippen, and Ron Harper. But Kirk should also be made an example of. He's not good enough. And yes, he is a scrappy short craig eloh type player, but we need more and don't have any more time to wait on his to "snap out of it".

As long as Kirk Hinrich is a starting guard for the Chicago Bulls they will be losers. Again, it is not his fault. He plays hard and gives great effort. However, in the NBA, this is not nearly enough. How long will it take for you people to realize this! Please, before I burn my season tickets, put the ball in Gordon's hands and give Sefolosha more time and confidence at 2-guard. he can also play some point and guard the bigger guards. At this point we have nothing to lose. Barring a major trade substantially in the Bulls favor, which is not likely at this point, it is the only way to possibly save the season. Any knowledgeable basketball fan can see that offensively and defensively Hinrich is a major liability. Believe me, if the Bulls don't make this move they are doomed. Even Stevie Wonder can see it!!!!

Boylan has made the move (Gordon off the bench) that Skiles should have done after game ten. It's like groundhog day. Start Gordon, lose a bunch of games. Bring Gordon off the bench, win big time. This simple move would've saved Skiles job.

Gordon has to realize by now that when he starts the gunner mentality just isn't there. And when you're undersized for your position in the NBA, you need to do what you do best, often.

Now you can expect Tabo to be the starting 2 guard before the playoffs. And everyone will realize that Skiles got himself fired - not playing Thomas and Tabo - therefore, making Paxson look like an idiot for his personnel moves.

The Bulls will make the playoffs and advance to the 2nd round.

Going to game tonight and Mon. afternoon. Someone shoot me.

Keith if they were to get a legitimate point guard for Ben Gordon I don't see anything to regret. Yes he scores 20 points a night but also is responsible for giving up as many on the other end most nights and also guilty of over dribbling and forcing shots too often. He is best when moving without the ball and coming off screens. He's not capable of creating his own shot. The same can be said of Hinrich on the offensive end. What the Bulls need more than anything is a true point guard.

Is Hinrick related 2 Grossman?

How does anybody know if hinrich is a decent point guard? He spends most of his time guarding the oppositions best guard, so Gordon can have enough energy to hoist up bad shot after bad shot. Yes they did have a chance to draft Gay and Roy but instead they got Thomas and Sefolosha. Lets not even get into the Chandler trade. They gave him away for free then cut J.R. Smith who at the very least could have been packaged at the deadline. I don't know why we have 3 lottery picks just waisting away on the bench. If you are not going to play them trade'em. Why do you keep drafting unpolished bigs when you have damn near the NBA's smallest backcourt. Why did you sign Joe Smith when you already have Thomas and drafted Noah? The bulls also suffer from a serious lack of athletcism. It is much easier to coach an athlete to play defense then it is a non athlete. Alas thier is hope. Look at Andre Igoudala(a Chicago product) for Gordon, niether one signed an extention. Either that or someone needs to explain to gordon that there are not many jobs for SG who can't pass, play defense or handle the ball. If not what about to GS for Monta Ellis he is more scorer than shooter. Deng struggles against lesser, but more athletic opponents(see the Philly game), so why not trade him for a 1st round draft pick? That leaves Nocioni at the 3 and it frees up space in the rotation for Thomas and Noah. They basically need to trade the core for picks. If your not going to compete for a Championship why not see what your young people have. The Bulls need to talk to Golden State and the Timberwolves, The Warriors would love to have a Ben Wallace he would be a beast out west. Wallace and Gordon for Ellis, Biedrins and Maybe Patrick O'bryan. It gives the Warriors a real chance to compete in the west. What about Deng and Nocioni to Atlanta for Josh Smith(didn't sign his extension either)and Marvin Williams. By the way we don't need Jason Kidd, a playmaker needs shooters and finishers the Bulls have none. The roster needs to get more athletic. Hinrich isn't the best PG, he ain't the worst either, but in order to find out he needs scorers or shooters. Plus his contract is very reasonable.

Soldier Boy I like your suggested trades. I'm sorry, but Jason Kidd makes any athlete around him a weapon. He would turn Tyrus Thomas into Shawn Marion and mature our entire front line in no time. Smith wouldn't have to work as hard, and Kid knows how to score and get to the line when needed. Just getting a guard like Kidd ensures that you get calls and free agents to SERIOUSLY consider coming to Chicago.

Hinrich is stuck playing against the 2 guard because he is two SLOW to guard a point. He has no handles and cannot create his own shot. Dribbles to the rim - and doesnt shoot! But he is good defensively and that alone is what has kept him in the starting lineup. His contract is good, but I would move him and Wallace in a heartbeat.

OK..ive done some research...and...I did start the Nickname game with Gray, but....here is a comment from TimLittle a bit earlier than me.(check it)

Big Ben missed crucial free throws in the overtime period....would it have been better to have had Gray playing at that time? if Gray had been on the floor for that last play in regulation would he have made the put back on BG's air ball?
what do you think Roman?

Roman responds: I don't have a problem with Skiles' moves yesterday. The Gray scenario is intriguing, though. Ben's FT shooting does make him a liability.

Posted by: Tim Little | November 1, 2007 09:28 AM

Gray?
Posted by: bculz | November 1, 2007 03:25 PM

BUT.....then again...CHECK THIS OUT!!!!

Gray - AirCraft Carrier type we will need in playoff run. Could be sleeper Big man pick up of the entire draft!
Posted by: bculz | October 17, 2007 07:56 PM

TALK TO ME.

I still think we should look into Igoudala. He is a big athletic guard who can play defense, yes his J is suspect, but he would be a perfect 2 guard. Now that Boylan is running and uptempo game he needs more athletes. How bad would Detroit like to have Big Ben back? They have a rookie by the name of Rodney Stuckey. I saw him in the summer and he is the real deal his jumpshot is decent, but he is a strong ballhandler and is very good at attacking the rim. Either one would be a very good starting point. The thing the Bulls have in thier favor is alot of teams feel they have a legitimate chance to win the title. Although they don't have any Allstars the Bulls have pieces, pieces that can net them draft picks. I heard a rumor the Bulls were talking to the cavs about hughes and gooden for hinrich and someone else. C'mon Larry Hughes stays hurt. Plus we already have to many Goodens. Why aren't Thomas and Sefolosha not playing? It seems like Boylans system is tailor made for them

cilzie ty for the cred, and yes you did tag him as an aircraft carrier about the same time I had mentioned he was a credible center in the mold of a Luc Longley.

the Bulls should have won todays game in regulation unfortunately once again over dribbling caused a turn-over leading to the overtime. But all in all a good effort through out the game.

You know it Tim...im as fair as Zero Balanced Digital Scale!

Soldier Boy - Igoudala is their franchise player, but I would give them Hinrich and Joe Smith for him. Or they can send us Andre Miller and Rodney Carney. I would pull the trigger for Ai or Andre Miller.

I don't know about yall, but I like Gerald Wallace of the Bobcats. I know the Bulls have been whipping them soundly, but they are a team ready to deal. I would offer them Deng or Gordon for Gerald Wallace or Jason Richardson. Or Gordon and Hinrich for Wallace, Richardson and a draft pick. I would make some combination deal for Gerald Wallace. Even if it meant sending Tyrus Thomas and Gordon or Hinrich and Thomas. I am high on Wallace because of his all around ability - and like I said BEFORE Stacey King said it last night - he is a poor man's scottie pippen. The emphasis will be on his defense and ability to guard at the 2-3 positions.

Deng is the OTHER player we have to shop regardless of how we feel about him. He or Gordon will have to go because of contracts. Kirk and Duhon are too small. But Gordon, Deng, Hinrich have the most apeal on the market. Throw in Tyson (lowest hoops IQ) to sweeten the deal (unless you are dealing for a point guard).