Chicago Sun-Times

Source: Carolina won't franchise Peppers

| 29 Comments | No TrackBacks

As long as the Bears need defensive line help, Julius Peppers will remain part of the conversation, as unlikely as Peppers coming to Chicago might be.

A league source told profootballtalk.com that the Panthers don't plan to use the franchise tag on Peppers because it would mean the team would have to tender him $21.8 million for the 2010 season, or $1.326 million per game. Putting the transition tag on Peppers would put Carolina in the same situation.

That means that if Peppers does walk away from the Panthers after eight years the team won't receive compensation, although not having to cough up $21.8 million might be viewed as compensation enough.

Peppers will never get that much on the open market but he's still the great white whale of free agency. The Bears are desperate. General manager Jerry Angelo and coach Lovie Smith know their jobs are on the line next season and therefore may be willing to go to extremes, but having so much money tied up in two defensive players --- Brian Urlacher's cap number is $10.32 million --- may not be the best idea.

No TrackBacks

TrackBack URL: http://blogs.suntimes.com/cgi-bin/mt-tb.cgi/29473

29 Comments

Too much money for a guy who has shown lapses in motivation. Just like Albert Haynesworth, this guy will get overpaid this year.

Hopefully, the signing of Cutler to an extension will mean they are going to devote more energy to the offensive side of the ball in free agency and the draft. We brought in WRs, but we need to rebuild the line. Paring down salaries on the defensive side of the ball is what we need to do, not bring in more big ones. Cutler needs a new center, 2 new guards, and likely will need at least one tackle. We also need a running back who is big enough to ride the big boy rides at Great America, and can run with some purpose.

This team has too many holes to spend that kind of cash on one guy. Alex Brown had it right when he said you can fill several holes with that same amount of money. Kampmann will be more economical, especially coming off injury. We then could try and get our hands on a free safety, and perhaps LT could get a few more years of solid production in Martz's offense, as he is one of the best receiving backs in the NFL (if not the best) over the last decade. Forte and LT is a huge improvement over Forte and Wolfe.

The market will get out of control fast with Peppers, so I say let it. While that is going on, start conversations with Kampmann, and bring in a couple of other guys for a look while you are doing it.

lets go bears going to win first game all way

14 Sacks last year? He was disappointed by his sacks the previous year and so he turned himself around, and did better. I see that as self motivation/improvement. Who was the last DE we had that did that? Yes we can fill several holes with that same money but the holes are filled by the likes of other teams rejects that come here and don't do diddly and dont cost Jerry/Ted/McCaskeys as much as a ProBowler does. Adams/Omiyale/Goon and to lesser extent even Shaffer, geez how many rejects can Jerry buy with that kind of money? oh and Brown doesn't have to worry about getting benched for non-motivational play and minimum sacks if Jerry `fills holes' with rejects right?
Joe, we will always have `holes to fill' if Jerry keeps signing other teams rejects, and as much as I want Omiyale at RT, Creighton was right when he said that Omiyale wasnt a very good pickup. But we are all thinking he will play great at our RT. Why? because we have ppoor players across the board, we NEVER set our sights on the great Free Agent signings. Who did the Saints pickup last year? We coulda done that and already been winning. But nope, we (Jerry signs `alot of ppoor players for that kind of money'

Now I agree we need better Oline help, but I `aint' seen that happen yet either, so lets at least get a DE that wants to improve instead of keeping the ones that DONT want to pick up a player better than they are. lol

Joe I like the way you think. I agree that Julius Peppers is NOT the player the Bears should be looking after. Aaron Kampman is a more reasonable acquisition. I also think that FS Kerry Rhodes would be a nice addition in the Bears cover 2 scheme. Neither player had a good year playing in the 3-4 last year; so a change of scenery would probably do them some good. If the Bears can get LT, that would be awesome. Martz could switch up from Forte to LT; use both in the passing game as well.

Wish list time. Like the idea of Kampmann, Rhodes and L.T. in free agency.

In order of priority I would say, KAmpmann,Boldin,Rhodes then L.T.

If the Bears could get those four (will never happen) then a statue would be made for Angelo at the stadium.

A third round draft pick and emphasis in the draft must be to acquire either a starting Left Offensive Guard or Free Safety, depending how the Bears move the line around prior to the draft.

Go Bears, despite the angst of watching you under perform for the last three years. If nothing else it will be an interesting year in Chicago. The year of change for the better or worse we will see?

Unfortunately, regardless of who gets a franchise tag, or how much the Bears have to spend on Free Agents, they just can't fill all their holes. The huge number of unrestricted free agents and the small number of Bears draft picks mean that, if they are very lucky, they might find one quality starter for each side of the ball. That will not be enough to upgrade a slumping defence or an offensive line that is getting old on the interior. We are headed for a tough year.

If you can get a player like Peppers, you get a player like Peppers.

If the Bears can generate a pass rush, they won't have all those "holes."

That has been the problem the past three seasons.

Peppers, when motivated, is one of the most dominate ends in the league.

His appearance would help every single player on the defense, because Cover 2 requires a pass rush. There is no better pass rusher on the market -- if not league, than Peppers. And he can still play the run.

It's an uncapped year anyway. The team could front load his salary.

Just remember anything can happen in the off season. Don't assume the players we have now are the players we will have on opening day. Last year at this time Kyle Orton was our starting QB, I know it wasn't a great year for Cutler, but I think the Bears showed they can supprise you. And for those who say the Bears are to cheep to play players; they were 10th highest roster salary in '08. I couldn't find the number for '09 but I know it was close. Go Bears, don't write 2010 off just yet! Go Bears!

If the Bears did sign Peppers he would probably get hurt in the first game, knowing the Bears luck.

Have the Bears made any mention of interest in LT? I like that idea a lot as well. He's not the back he used to be, but his strength this year was in the short yardage and goal line situations, which is exactly where Forte fell short. Sounds like a great way to start converting those third and ones and touchdowns, instead of punts and field goals.

I'm not going to make this long. [ I hope we have a great year next year, because i like Lovie and i think we have some gems on the team and if we let them play for a spot we might not have that many holes ] { Now, If we still have a lot of holes this is another reason why Angelo needs to go... iF I'm nOt miSTAken The Bears had 20 mil this past season, just hanging around not OwEd to anyone, and what did Angelo do with that money might u say.. Angelo gave it to Cutler after a 3-1 start.. What could we do with that money now? Poor Management }


{ DONT WORRY I'LL WAIT }

Kampman is still a huge question mark, his knee may never be the same. Peppers is the better player but spent his whole career in a 2 gap system. One thing to remember is weather it is Peppers or Kampamn or whoever if the money is close, they will go with the better team. They will look at who they play next to, if its a bum who may make them look bad forget it, if the coach is a lame duck rather than a Sean Payton, guess who they will go with?. The Bears are not a prime location for free agents right now, which mean they will have to pay more than the other guys, probably overpay to get talent.

The Packers want Kampman back, not that he wants to go back to them, but he would love to play for the Texans who use a 4-3 1 gap system. Playing with Williams would be a nice 1-2 punch.

Porter was just released by the Phins, well all the big cuts are starting.

LT is done, Leon Washington would be a great fit with the Bears and Martz. He will probably stay with the Jets but the Bears could make a hard push for him.

Jammal Brown or Bushrod may become available because of salary. Bushrod could be a RT in the Martz system for the Bears if he is let go. However he has played zone his whole pro career.

Tank Johnson is a FA and has been a model citizen with the Bengals, the Bears may look to bring him back.

Their really isn't going ot be a lot on the market this year with the CBA up in the air.

I still say the Bears need to start packaging some of their players and try to get a couple of second round picks.

Olsen, doesn't fit the new system. He may hold second round value to a team. But their are a lot of Pass catching TE's out there.

Jamar Williams

Tommie Harris

Brian Urlacher, The steelers have made a killing by knowing when to trade aging players to pick up draft picks that benifit the team. Urlacher still holds first round value to some teams and Hunter did a good enough job filling in for him. Urlacher didn't get the Bears to the playoff's in 07, 08, 09.

The Bears have been trying to win with a loosing team for the last three years. Time to change it up. Young up and comming talent is always better than old fading talent.

Just a thought, but should the Bears focus most of their FA money on aging players like Kampman and Peppers who are in their 30's, to try and revive a struggling aging defense that hasn't been good in 3 seasons. They haven't changed the system or coaches on defense, their best players are past their prime, and the defense is designed to be successful with a ball control offense that doesn't turn the ball over and controls the clock, and needs turnovers.

They now have a high scoreing offensive system that is designed to score fast and often, at the expense of turnovers, sacks, and clock managment. All their best young talent is on offense but they still need upgrades at several key positions in order to be effective.

Young talent offense:
Jay Cutler
Knox
Forte
DA
Williams (Maybe)
Olsen (Should be traded because he doesn't fit the system, but at least holds some value)
Bennett
Hester (In the slot where he has belonged the last 2 years)

Young Talent Defense:
Bowman (Maybe)
Harrison (Doubtful)
Ummmmm

So do you try and save a failing, againg defense by adding older players past their prime? How long will they last a year or two, and they cost a fortune?

Or do you focus on the offense and let a new coach with a new scheme fix the defense after Smith is gone. The Bears have been going backwards for three years and have been doing nothing other than patch working and hoping that aging players suddenly return to their primes. Or that bad players suddenly become good for no other reason than thats what Lovie wants. "This guys is going to become a player because I want him ot be a player, and what Lovie wants Lovie gets"

I would love to see Chicago sign Julius Peppers, the question is...will they? I won't say either way, because who would of thought this time last year Chicago was trying to get Jay Cutler? The answer, nobody outside of Halas Hall.

I say go for him, this regime only has one year to make this scheme work, and a legit pass rusher is the only way this scheme will ever work. The current ends on Chicago's roster simply cannot get to the QB on a consistent basis, so the answer is probably not on the roster. Gaines Adams was suppose to be the answer, and its nobodies fault what happened to him. Also, the answer at DE is not in the draft in round #3, the Bears have got to land a free agent pass rusher. If Tommie Harris can get back to form, and he did start to look better as the season went on, along with Peppers, and Chicago could have a very nice front four.

As far as a free safety or the secondary as a whole, think how much better they would look with any kind of a pass rush. Oh yeah, Urlacher will be back next year to help out in coverage. You take Urlacher, Briggs, Tillman, a healthy Tommie Harris along with big J. Peppers on the front, and some young guys stepping up in the secondary like Bowman or D.J. Moore, and this defense could be one of the leagues best. I say money should not be an option, do what you gotta do to field a winning defense.

Bottom line is this, this defense is not going anywhere without a pass rush, and Julius Peppers seems like the best option. Even Kampmann probably wouldn't help right away next year coming off the injury, I say bring Peppers in. Back in the day when the Pack signed the late Reggie White, who was in the league around the same amount of time as Peppers has been right now, well... that worked out pretty good for them. I say make the same move with Peppers in the now, what else have the Bears got to loose other than 10-13 games next season? As far as motivating Peppers, that shouldn't be a problem with the new coaching staff i.e. Marinelli GO BEARS!!

Why would we need Peppers? Angelos has spent fairly high picks in recent years on defensive ends. Why don't we just put in Dan Bazuin (whom we traded Thomas Jones and a second round pick for) and Henry Melton from last year's draft. Err, never mind...

I can see Kampman as a better fit if he's healthy enough at the time FA begins. Not sure if that's possible, but certainly the Bears are in desperate mode; especially on defense. DE and FS are sticking out like very sore thumbs right now, and need to be addressed in free-agency.

how about going for thomas jones hes most likely wanting out from the jets.. and crazy but how about making urlacher a strong safety?? thats what he played in college move briggs or willams to the middle pisa and brown on the outside.. could work! also i would trade olsen in a minute cant block and overrated

Da Bears are unfortunately two to three years away from the Super Bowl (at least), but not from a Wild Card berth, however. The problem with this team in the past is a three headed monster. What I mean to say, is that Halas Hall and Lovie cannot develop RAW talent effectively (the 06 thru 09 draft classes, except Knox and Afalava), or motivate discouraged slash lazy players enough (Vasher or the front 4), and avoid over the hill slash injury prone FAs that are ex players of the coaches (Pace or Jones). They also try to force personnel to fit their scheme, instead of adapting their design to their roster (Cutler or Omiyale). Now with that said, Angelo has acquired some unpolished gems over the years plus some interesting journeymen and rookies recently as well. I'm speaking of course of the talent we actually have that makes us a .500 team with promise (like the Houston Texans).

On the O line we have Williams, Kreutz, and Garza as starters for certain. Chris showed promise and Olin is a leader who only benefits from a bone spur removal and Mike Tice's arrival (that goes for aging, but solid Roberto too). The rest of the line depends on the coaches' film review and this summer's position battles. Not including the 2010 draft, we currently have Omiyale, Beekman, Shaffer, Marten, Louis, Reed, and Asiata. Frank at LG was about a 90 percent flop, so he figures to fight it out with Kevin and James at RT (Orlando Pace is gonna retire I think). Josh is Kreutz's heir, so they'll keep him as his backup and a LG last resort (meanwhile Lance and Johann will need to strut their stuff). Tyler is another Angelo practice squad bust like Brandon Rideau. Drafting a big, balanced guard would be nice though.

On the D line we still have Brown, Harris, Harrison, Adams, Idonije, Gilbert, Melton, Toeaina, and Anderson (what with Ogunleye leaving as an UFA and Gaines Adams' tragic passing). Alex is consistentl

On the D line we still have Brown, Harris, Harrison, Adams, Idonije, Gilbert, Melton, Toeaina, and Anderson (what with Ogunleye leaving as an UFA and Gaines Adams' tragic passing). Alex is consistent but not flashy. Also, maybe it's time we relegate Mark to a backup role (he produces more the less he's tired) and pick up Peppers or Kampmann to add some much needed bite to our pass rush. Israel, Matt, Anthony, and Marcus are solid as depth chart fillers. Jarron and Henry must use their playing time to prove the hype surrounding them as future starters. Sadly, Tommie will never be the disruptive force he once was, but if spelled judiciously, he'll contribute. Development is key here folks.

Safeties are a big reason why Da Bears have fallen from grace since 2006 (after the pass rush and QB performance, but before O line play in terms of influence). 21 changes at FS and 20 changes at SS says it all. Afalava, Payne, Manning, Steltz, and Bullocks are expected to be evaluated yet again this offseason. Josh is by far the most experienced and stable player left, (even if he is not as full of potential like the others) because Nathan Vasher is going to be cut I hope. Al and Daniael made plays, but were inconsistent before they were injured (once was a rookie and the other developed badly, so I'm not too critical). Kevin underperformed and has joined fellow DB Corey Graham in the coaches' doghouse. Craig progressed this year, but still needs work. Draft priority for this position better be high up in Bourbonnais.

LBs is the D's strongest group and the corners are decent enough (but they all need to stay healthy for most of next season). The QB is the 1st Phase's biggest weapon and the RBs, WRs, or TEs could use an upgrade to maximize their dangerousness (promote Bell, trade Olsen, acquire Boldin, et cetera). Let's all pray the coaches play nice together and that Jay stays healthy. Remember also, that the Tampa 2 needs strength up the middle (DT, MLB, FS) to work. SO BEAR DOWN, CHICAGO!

Why would we trade Olsen, "he doesn't fit the scheme" is what we are told. Well, let me be the first to tell you all that this is a one year system and another one will be in place in 2011 with the new head coach and GM. And a pass catching TE that can spread out wide forcing bad matchups for opposing teams is all the rage.

The Peppers question is pretty simple to me. The Bears need talent. They have to either buy it, or draft and develop it. They don't have many draft picks so they are going to have to buy some talent. Peppers would be an excellent place to start.

That said, I don't know why everybody has given up on Gilbert and Melton? We knew when they were drafted that they were raw talents that would need time to develop. Yes the jury is still out, but those guys are still promising prospects. I especially like Melton. That guy is a good football player just looking for a position.

I have been reading some of your posts and have concluded a lot of you know squat. It all starts in the trenches on both sides of the line. This is the single largest failure and that is on JA. Also, this team needs to get younger not older and that means parting with some players. I think Creighton is correct about trading a couple of players for draft picks. Olsen does not fit the system and the Bears should be able to get at least a second round pick. Also, Urlacher would probably fetch a second vs. a first round but you shed his $10M plus salary. Before people go off the deep end... Remember, we played without him all of last year with the exception of maybe one half of football and fared well.

The problem in this system is the pass rush. Everything about it is predicated on getting pressure upfront. You reallocate some of the money gained from trading Urlacher to the D-line. The problem is where? An aging Julius Peppers and a fat contract is a potential recipe for disaster(Albert Haynesworth). However, if you do get 10-12 sacks out of him for a couple of years it will make the secondary(where help is direly needed) look less vulnerable. This buys time to draft a couple of lineman(hopefully, with one of the picks from any trades) to groom for the future. With that said, use some late round picks to fill-out the secondary. That seems to be the only skill JA has for evaluation purposes.

The O-line is an entirely different animal. We need interior line help badly. Olin K is probably gone after next year and Josh B is a question mark. We need to address this issue any way possible(FA and draft). I heard some chatter about LT. Well....I am not sure LT and Forte are complimentary backs. Agreed, they could both thrive in a Martz style offense but, I believe Chester Taylor would be a better matchup. CT hits the hole hard, is a veteran and has fresher legs. Also, he can catch passes out of the backfield as well.

Lastly, I am tired of hearing about Boldin. He is a great receiver but, is he a true number one? Everyone knows that L Fitzgerald is the alpha male in AZ. Does this translate to Boldin as a number one too? I don’t think so! He might be a better alternative than what we have but, is he suited for Martz system. Also, he will want number one $$$ when nobody is certain he is a true number one receiver. With that said, I do not recall Holtz, Proehl and Bruce being household names before Martz. I believe one of these three was a rookie at the time. Am I saying Hester, Knox and Bennett are the next ”Show on Turf” or sod, HELL NO! I am just saying that it appears receivers are factored differently in the Martz scheme.

In the end this team is in rebuild mode whether you like it or not. I have absolutely no faith the current regime will turn it around next year. With that said, the whole formula goes out the window because a new staff means personnel changes.

Signing Peppers, in theory, would improve the whole defense. A good pass rusher would mean the defensive backs could play more aggressively and not have to cover as long, and the other defensive linemen would be single blocked. The biggest problem with signing Peppers is what it could do to the Bears' roster in the future. The goal of the owners for the new labor agreement is to get the salary cap lowered. So while there is no cap this year, Peppers contract (assuming the Bears do the traditional spreading the guaranteed money or signing bonus over the entire contract) would cripple the team in future years. Unless the Bears front load everything in the contract this year, which I do not see the Bears doing. Plus, as Creighton has pointed out, how many big contracts can the Bears have on defense? But wow, he would look good on the Bears defensive line this year.

There is one other way the Bears could get a 2nd rounder. Teams in the past have traded their next years 1st round pick for a 2nd rounder in the current draft. That's I believe how the Bears ended up with two first round picks in 1983 (thank you Tampa Bay for Willie Gault) and more recently the Colts trade their 2008 1st rounder for the 2nd round pick in 2007 and the right to draft Tony Ugoh. I don't think the Bears would do something like this because they usually do not target specific players, which is usually why you would make this type of trade. I also bet the team that trades the future first ends up regretting it.

Everyone talks about needing more talent on the line and this is very true.

But not having a lot of talent doesn't mean you can't get to the QB. Why have the Bears not been able to get to the QB though? Lovie wants an elite front 4 and his system is based on this. If he has 4 guys who can all get to the QB his defense will be really good. But whose defense wouldn't be good with 4 elite pass rushers?

The Vikings are an example of what Lovie wants, Allen the Williams wall and Edwards. By position all of them are better than what the Bears have. After them their defense is not very special. Good coordinators and defensive minds find a way to get to the QB. Your not going to have an elite front 4 very often, and when you have one its easy to be good and thats what Lovie wants, he wants it to be easy cause he has no clue how to blitz.

Look at the Eagles, they run a one gap system just like the Bears but outside of Cole nobody is anything special, but boy do they get after the QB using blitz's.

Or how about the Jets? Yes they are a 3-4 but who do they have rushing the QB? Calvin Pace, they didn't even have a lot of sacks but boy did they put on the pressure, forced teams to get rid of the ball quickly. The Packers also didn't have an elite pass rusher but still got after the QB, by being aggressive, and blitzing, and mixing things up.

Everyone says boy if we just had like 4 more blue chip players the defense would be much better. But thats true of any team. Good teams find a way to get to the QB, your not always going to have a list of All Pro players. But the Bears don;t do that, they don't have an elite front 4, they are horrible at blitzing and disguising coverage, and they don't mix anything up. The Bears blitz a lot, they just don't have good blitz's and don't disguise anything and do little to confuse the QB. How many A-Gap blitz's are they gong to attempt?

You don't need 50 sacks to be good or an elite line, what you do need is good game planning and aggressive schemes. Which we don't have. The Saints don't have a great D, but boy are they aggressive, and that worked well enough for them against the Colts didn't it? Lovie will never be an aggressive play caller. Bend don't break, thats his philosophy. Lovie's defense plays back and is nothing more than a prevent.

Everyone always wonders was it Rivera or was it Lovie in 2005 and 2006. Yes it was a tampa 2. But Rivera was aggressive, Harris had 3 sacks in 05, the team had 41 sacks total which is a good number, but that defense was attacking, thats what Rivera coached it was aggressive, he learned that from Ryan. Lovie didn't agree with this he believed his his often repeated "bend, don't break." You can see Rivera continues his aggressive approach with the Chargers and you can see how Lovie moved more into his prevent style.

You don't need a lot of of sacks as long as you are getting constant pressure and confusing the QB. That is what the difference has been from 05 to now. You can put whoever you want on the Bears line but unless you are aggresive, and confusing the QB, you will get ripped apart. Lovie wants to sit back and hope his guys strip the ball, thats part of his scheme. You have even heard multiple players say, let us get after it. Briggs, Urlacher, Harris, Brown, have all talked about their desire to be more aggressive on defense. Even their blitzing is passive. You can see Lovie's personality in his defense just like you can with most coordinators, its passive aggressive, bend, don't break and hope for a strip or turnover. Bending = passive, strip or int = aggressive, or making a play after a play has been made. It doesn't work.

I feel we are 2-3 great players away from the SB, All of the DE mentioned above are underperforming, the ones we drafted last year we havent seen enough of to evaluate (typical Lovie) Peppers has probably 3 great years left, Can anyone not want 10-15 sacks per from that positon? That would alone free up the DT to do their thing, and with Pisa we do have a strong LB corps, Peppers would free up the LB as well, how much money is ONE player worth that would alone, help all other D positions?? Rushing the passer cuts down on the time the DB's have to hold their man too. Peppers can make our entire D better by himself. Thats why he's worth that much money, same as when Jerry signed Tait/Brown/Garza and we went to the Super Bowl, a great ProBowler with 3 great years left is a perfect signing, unlike Pace who just simply did not have those 3 years left, thats the difference in Peppers and a Tait/Brown vs a Pace. 3 great years from a previous extremely weak DE position would be (along with another Rueben Brown type signing) enough to get us over the hump and at the least 2 games into the playoffs if not further. With the different Offensive philosphy, and new passing schemes/play calling theres no way our Offense wont be better than last year, (maybe not great with the learning curve) but I heard some good things from Martz, he knows what this team needs and remember the yards that Cutler had? Combine that with a much strenghtened DE pass rush and you have the makings of a playoff team and more. For this Martz thing to work and work great we must have some ProBowl players. Peppers can do that. and a Top OG signing. or we can sign another Pace/Omiyale/Adams and be in the same boat agin next year. Ill take that chance on Peppers.

Of course if someone had been thinking and was prepared for Peppers to sign we might have that 2nd pick still in our pocket. Doh!
So we HAD to have a DE so bad we gave our second pick but Peppers is NOT worth the money??? right....

Why not try to sign both Kampman and Peppers? And Wilfork too if he's available?

Why not try to get as good as possible. Both Angelo and Smith's tenures are on the line this season. Why wouldn't they try to pull out all the stops?

I know I am probably dreaming, but a front 7 of Peppers, Harris, Wilfork, and Kampman backed by linebackers Briggs, Urlacher, and Tinosimoa sounds pretty good to me. They at least have to try to get all these guys.

The line is key (I know I'm preaching to the quior). They need to take what they can while the gettins good.

Oh well, hope it happens.

Leave a comment

Twitter updates

Categories

About this Entry

This page contains a single entry by Neil Hayes published on February 12, 2010 7:41 AM.

Holt available after veteran cut by Jags was the previous entry in this blog.

Holt: "It's a match made in heaven" is the next entry in this blog.

Find recent content on the main index or look in the archives to find all content.